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Forums10
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Most Online1,344 Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 180
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 180 |
we need a Damascus expert here - which I am decidedly not!
could 'single key', 'double key' & perhaps 'strip' have something to do with number of layers - or perhaps the appearance of the Damascus? I just don't know.
rgds Gunter
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 433 Likes: 78
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 433 Likes: 78 |
Here are the barrels of the Colleye System gun.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228 |
Nice set of pattern welded tubes. So Gunter are you referring to >>Laminated<<, >>Twist<< >>2 Iron<<, >>3 Iron<<??
German terms dealing w/ tubes in advert:
Bandläufen, Drahtläufen, Eisenläufen, Eisenrohr, Stahlrohr, etc.
The advert mentions >>feinen Damastläufen<< further down so I don't know?
Cheers,
Raimey rse
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Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 180
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 180 |
Raimey, I am not referring to anything in particular! I did say that I don't know anything about Damascus barrels as I thought I had made clear in my message(s)!!??
I provided two (correct) translations of two separate texts relating to two separate questions in this thread and also, as an aside, gave my personal opinion of what I thought might be a possible explanation/description of a put question while stating clearly that I am NOT an expert in this particular field (Damascus barrels)!
I have no idea whether anything might relate to 'laminated' 'twist', '2iron', '3iron' or anything else - as I said, I AM NOT a Damascus expert
So why have a go at me??
I shall think twice in future before I give a translation!
I am too old to get upset for trying to help people!
Gunter
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 433 Likes: 78
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 433 Likes: 78 |
Thank you all for your time and help in translating and figuring out these texts. It is greatly appreciated.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228 |
Gunter: Not sure how you took my post, but it seems you took it any way but the proper way. I was just trying to understand your line of reasoning & from there try to find some correlation. Also, not sure which word or phrase tripped the switch on the tracks, but it wasn't intended in that manner. I try to listen to all posters, maybe less Ford, and my record here on the BBS well supports this. I just thought you & Ford may have been there when they rolled the tubes? Cheers, Raimey rse
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228 |
[img] https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v...&fit=bounds[/img] Boy Photobucket has really changed again. Anyway, hopefully this link is to a legible snippet. Cheers, Raimey rse
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228 |
Ah, hah. I have found it from 1829:
>>Drahtläufen Ueber eine Hülse wird wie bey den Bandröhren ein starker Eisendraht spiralförmig dicht an einander und mehrmahls über einander gewunden bis das Rohr die erforderliche Stärke erhalten hat hierauf wird das Rohr wie gewöhnlich geschweißt und nach Vollendung desselben die Hülse ausgebohrt Diese Gattung Röhre welche besonders in Kärnthen erzeugt werden haben den Vortheil der Gewundenen nur ist zur Erzeugung derselben zu viel Zeit erforderlich wodurch ihr Vorzug wieder verloren geht Uebrigens kann man bey den Drahtröhren mit mehr Gewißheit auf die Güte derselben als bey den Gewundenen und Gedrehten rechnen indem es unmöglich ist aus einer schlechten Gattung Eisen Draht zu erzeugen Diese Röhre sind jedoch nicht mit den uralten und gleich Anfangs verworfenen Drahtröhren canon filé zu verwechseln welche eben so mit umgewundenem Drahte auf einem Rohre vorbereitet aber anstatt geschweißt mit Schlagloth und Borar gelöthet wurden von der Hülse wurde auch nur die Hälfte höchstens ausgebohrt Ueberdieß bestand der Pulversack auf einer Länge von 10 bis 12 Zoll durchaus aus geschmiedetem Eisen Es ist sonderbar genug daß sich kürzlich Jemand bey der österreichischen Artillerie gemeldet hat welcher dieses Verfahren als neu angab und auf diese Art sogar grobe Geschütze verfertigen wollte ohne sich dabey einer eisernen Hülse zum Umwinden und Löthen des Drahtes bedienen zu wollen.......<<
https://books.google.com/books?id=43dAAAAAcAAJ&lpg=PA142&ots=e5VQIbul2F&dq=Drahtl%C3%A4ufen&pg=PA143#v=onepage&q=Drahtl%C3%A4ufen&f=false
Cheers,
Raimey rse
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,124 Likes: 228 |
Wire Roughing Over a sleeve, as with the band tubes, a strong iron wire is wound spirally close to each other and several times over each other until the tube has received the required strength, then the pipe is welded and slackened as usual
This genus tubes, which are especially produced in Carinthia, have the advantage of the tortuous, but too much time is required to produce them, whereby their merit is lost again. By the way, with the wire tubes one can confidently ascertain the goodness of them To make twisted and twisted pieces, it is impossible to make wire from a bad kind of iron
These tubes, however, are not to be confused with the ancient and immediately discarded wire tubes canon filé which are prepared with wound wire on a tube but instead of welded with pestle and borar loosened from the sleeve only half were drilled out at the most On a length of 10 to 12 inches it is certainly made of forged iron. It is curious enough that somebody recently reported to the Austrian artillery who indicated that this procedure was new and in this way even wanted to make rough guns without having to use an iron sleeve for winding and To serve soldering of the wire......
Forced, poor translation.
Cheers,
Raimey rse
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,528 Likes: 354
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,528 Likes: 354 |
Very interesting reference to Carinthia. This is the damascus sample display in the Buchsenmacher u. Jagdmuseum of Ferlach, and Carinthia is upper right Steve's tube certainly appears to be 3 iron acid etched Bernard I, which was a very popular pattern in quality Ferlach and Suhl guns This is a close up of the acid etched Carinthia sample, unfortunately taken through the glass of the display case I don't see the repetitive pattern of loops in Steve's barrel, which carries the Liege provisional proof and ML in an oval - likely Manufacture Liégeoise (1866-1929) though usually a crowned ML. 17.2 should be the bore in mm = .677" or an overbored 16g? 14g is .693"
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