doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Wrong gun for the wrong job at the wrong time

Carry a pair of binoculars and stay the hell away from them??
How about,to shoo him away, those whistling bird bomb shells that scream and explode at 100 yards??

Get a cannister of bear spray and carry it with you in a quick-draw holster. Thats what trailriders do around YellowStone National Park. Let us know if it works on M'Bogos...if we don't hear back fom you I guess we'll know it didn't...Geo

LGF, you might want to consider these slugs http://www.ada.ru/Guns/hunting/slugs/rubeykina/index.htm Sorry, the text is Russian, but what you need are the blueprints anyway. The dimensions are in millimeters (you need the top right-hand pic).

These bullets are all brass, made on a lathe, a do-it-yourself kind. They are loaded in a plastic shot cup, which protects the bore along with the fact that these slugs are way underbore. They were used on bear and moose when sproting rifles in the USSR were illegal, and always produced excellent killing power with very deep penetration. For the "last resort" cartridge you can load'em up. A solid weighting 33 gramms and leaving the muzzle at 450 meters per second is an equivelent of the 12 bore rifle, which if the books I read were the right kind, used to be a reliable short-range killer of the Big Five in its time.

So, what's the downside?

Chuck H,

Those are the very same guns that were made by Valmet of Finland, it appears from the photos. Very well made for a production gun, but I don't recall them having ever made any of the combination guns with the rifle barrel chambered for a caliber large enough to do the job LGF needs.

Stan

Bob Brister killed a cape buff w/ brenneke slugs and it was deliberate, not an emergency situation. however, i'm sure he was able to pick his shots. in your situation, you won't have that luxury. but under the circumstances, short of a back-up carrying a heavy rifle (and in all likelihood you'd be between him and the target), it's the best you can do and would certainly be better than nothing.

i know askins the younger isn't popular but nonetheless, in his shotgun book, there's a chapter in which he was testing the latest auto's (latest as of late 1950's) and he ran 3" magnums thru them all just to see what would happen. not only did none of them blow up, none were even damaged and a few almost worked flawlessly. as noted, you won't be doing the gun any favors, but the gun may be a small price to pay for getting out alive.

roger

Robert Ruark (sp?) said it best. Use enough gun. That said, would one of the heavy caliber revolvers be up to the job? Say, one of those .500 S&W beasts. Don't know if they issue a trailer hitch and wheels with the thing or not.
-- Ed

Gentlemen,

Many thanks for all the thoughtful answers to my question. Unless someone has a suggestion for carrying a .470 and a shotgun, I guess I better try and bring over some 2¾” slugs, and keep one barrel choked more open. Yogi - many thanks for the kind offer to roll some up. I will get in touch when I am back in the US. Don’t those Russian slugs sound cool?

To answer some of the points raised:

Reloading is illegal here. Years ago I would have happily put components and a small press in my luggage anyway, but these days TSA might have issues.

Handgun: I have a high capacity .460 Rowland (a glorified .45 that thinks it’s a .44 magnum), but I would much rather trust in something big coming out the end of a shotgun. I could never get a permit to bring in a second handgun, even if I could hit anything with a revolver. Anyway, a buffalo with a handgun??? No way.

Buckshot: That’s for bucks. I autopsied a lion (dear old Number 4) who had been killed by a herder with buckshot – she was ancient and starving, and had two tries at his cows. He shot her when she went for him for pestering her. He was immensely lucky because a flier went through her brain. The other pellets were flattened under the skin of her foreleg.

H and H Paradox: I wish. Brno cost less than .5% the price of a Paradox. About my financial league.

Why are slugs illegal here? Lots of herders are armed with ancient shotguns (see above), and they would all be poaching even more than they already do if they had slugs. Most of those guns will probably blow up the first time anything is fired through them, but there are a lot of interesting old single shots around.

Pump or semiauto: Blasphemy! You should have seen how I was received on a pukka shoot when I showed up with my 1187 that wears black plastic, a pistol grip and an extended mag. Never invited back.

Bear spray: Often does not even deter bears; they like their lunch spicy. I have tried to break up fighting hyenas (in captivity) using bear spray, and they never even noticed it. There is always wind here.

Safety - the suggestion that I just stay home is really not on. I am certainly not brave, possibly foolish, but staying at home is not an option. I could sit at home in Berkeley and be less safe than out here. The African bush is not remotely as dangerous as one is led to believe – the hairy-chested hunters’ tales of charging this and attacking that nearly always refer to wounded animals; unprovoked attacks by anything are very rare. A certain famous ‘hunter’ who seems able to provoke a buffalo charge whenever a camera is present almost certainly does it by gut-shooting the animal first; it just don’t happen that regularly any other way. Having said than, however, a friend was killed by a buffalo last year on top of a rocky hill where no buffalo should have been, so it does happen occasionally. And someone else was killed by a hippo while duck hunting a couple of years ago. So a buffalo problem is not highly likely, but can happen.

I avoid the areas best beloved by buffalo, stay in relatively open country, and keep my eyes, ears and nose open. No surprises so far (36 years). Just some detours.

LGF-- Very thoughtful and reasoned response. I like your comment about you could stay at home, too, but that is not an option.

Your BRNO is a good gun.

As I understand your situation: you are out for a walk and bird hunting and while out for your walk & bird hunting you just MIGHT have to protect yourself from a Buff. You are NOT hunting Buff.

When you get to the US contact me if you still want some handloaded slugs and if not, if you use a far more open choke or cylinder on one of those barrels--those Brenneke's are one heck of a slug! ..And, while many may insist they cannot do enuff damage to a buff I would feel better with one of those in an open bore of your shotgun than a full and extra full choked shotgun with nothing but birdshot to shoot at it... although if you shot it right in the face you would probably blind it and do some considerable eye penetration damage... Regardless of whether you use a slug like a Big Brenneke or birdshot, the only way you'll shoot at it is if it is charging, and very close. Once again, you are NOT out there hunting it, you are out for your walk and possiblly a birdy or two. If you shoot a Buff it will most likely be at very close range. A massive 607 grain Brenneke packing over 3,000 KE could do some MAJOR damage at close range without a doubt.

I support you in your need to go out for a walk and taking along a birdgun and NOT a small arsenal for all that you may encounter. That said, I sure as heck would open one of those bores and have a few big-arsed slugs in my pocket.

I know the guy who fired 3" Brenneke slugs through half and full choke in IZH-27 "Baikal" chambered 2 3/4" - nothing happened, but the kick was pretty good, as the guy mentioned. But it was Baikal and fixed chokes.
In your case Briley thin wall tubes are the most delicate question. Usualy Briley titanium tubes fly away with buck shot all together

Some consider 300gr .375H&H to be mariginal round for this species. Gee, I don't think I would want to tango with this vegeterian .....!'bawling'