doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Fox single barrel trap

I also collect sbts. We need to start a group just for us. When I started to collect them, everyone told me to keep going for the Parker Bros., Fox, LC Smith s x s but I like the sbts. I too would like to get a Fox. It is the only one I am missing. I also agree that the Flues engraving on the Ithacas are better than the latter Knicks. I have both in the 4e and you can see the difference. I was lucky enough to get a 7E Ithaca Flues and that is really nice. Keep us posted on how you do and if you find one that you don't want, please let me know. Thanks, Frank

Believe it or not, John, Ansley Fox shot for Winchester using an 1897 pump. If he did use his Fox SBT they didn't last that long, probably because they Winchester Model 12s came along. Plus I think he sold out his business before too long. I think most people used Winchesters during that time so there wasn't much of a market for the single barrel trap guns for a long time to come. Now that is just about all you see.

There is even a difference between the early Flues and later one. Here are some pics of both. The early Flues has much finer engraving than the later. Also notice the early Flues dosent have the crossbolt thru the left receiver side, it is internal. The early gun is 1915 and the later gun is 1918 I think.
Ross

While Ithaca doubles were virtually non-existant at the big Live Bird Shoots, Ithaca seems to have dominated the classic single barrel trap gun market!?!

On 19 September 2005, on my way to The Vintage Cup, I stopped by Cabelas in Owatonna, MN, and they had three A.H. Fox Gun Co. single barrel trap guns in the gun library. They had J-Grade #400195 for $6500, L-Grade #400515 for $6500, and M-Grade #400476 for $45000. Some years ago at Shumans in Newville, PA, they had the last one, J-Grade #400568. It is the only one I've ever seen with the reprofiled top of the receiver as described in the red Savage-era Trap Gun folder. My Savage-era J-Grade 25 lower is not so profiled.

"Ithaca seems to have dominated the classic single barrel trap gun market!?!"
No argument regarding the market domination, not necessarily the trophies
Shooters using LC Smith guns won the Grand American Handicap in 02', 06', 11', 19', 20', 27', 28', 33', and 35'. G.W. Lorimer and W.E. Gordon took 1st and 2nd at the 1919 GAH. Using a Smith SBT, A.J. Stauber set the world's record in 1931 with 1087 straight clay targets. He also held the high average on A.T.A. 16-yard targets in 1926, 1927, 1928, and 1932. The first five high average shooters in the ATA in 1933 all used Smith guns. Walter Beaver won the 1933 Grand American and the 1934 and 1946 North American Clay Target Championships with a Specialty SBT. Jordan Royall, using a Smith SBT, and Sam Vance with a DBT, were 1st and 2nd in the 1935 GAH.

Have 3 L. C. Smiths - might consider selling.

1) SBT Eagle Grade - 56 made
2) SBT Specialty # 609 featured in Conley's Book.
3) SBT Spsialty

I shoot these on a regular basis.

Jim Reid

Bayflooring,

Check your PM's----TOOL MAN

Neat ad for Baker DBTs



and Smith DBTs. Bart Lewis used a Crown grade.

I'm sure what Rev says about L.C. Smiths is true, but 1902, 1906, and 1911 were before L.C. Smith SBTs. According to my 1928 Ithaca catalogue Ithaca SBTs won four GAHs in ten years, Charles Larson, John Henry, Elmer Starner, and Charles Young. By the 1934 catalogue they had six GAH winners in 15 years -- add A.E. Sheffield and Mose Newman to the list. By the 1936 catalogue add L.G. Dana winning the GAH with an Ithaca SBT. By the 1938 catalogue add Frank G. Carroll as another GAH winner with Ithaca SBT, making eight times the GAH was won with an Ithaca SBT. Also by 1938 Hale Jones had carried the high average two years in a row with .9878 amd .9905 with his Ithaca SBT. By 1939 Joe Hiestand had set a new World Record of 1404 straight with his Ithaca SBT, and by 1940 add D.L. Ritchie to the list of Ithaca GAH winners. By the 1947 Ithaca catalogue add two more GAH winners to the Ithaca SBT list -- Don Englebry and J.F. Halderman -- bringing the total to 11 GAH wins. By the 1953 catalogue Joe Hiestand's long run title was still holding.

The only thing I've ever found about a Fox SBT winning a big shoot was W.C. Letterman winning the Amateur Trap Shooting Championship of Pennsylvania on June 20, 1923, with a 198 x 200 with 168 straight. Also, Dr. J.D. Griffiths won the class B title with 193 x 200.

Yep, I knew that he was a shooter on the payroll of Winchester.
What I was trying to convey was my finding it odd that he had not built many of these guns while he was active in the gun business. He was such an odd man that the SBT should have been one that he would have pushed.
I understand that the Fox SBT gun was first offered in the 1919 Fox catalog, some seven years after he ran away to build shock absorbers, machine guns and the Finest Automobile in the World.:}.
Best,
John