doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Model 21 ejector problem

I just bought an older Winch Mod 21 in 16 gauge and the ejectors work perfectly when the gun is dry fired. But the left barrel one will eject just as soon as the gun is opened when both barrels are fired with ammo. The right barrel ejector waits until the gun is completely opened as it should. The knotch in the left ejector hammer look sharp not worn and the ejector sear tip doesn't look worn either. Any ideas please? Thank you.

The ejector sear has three critical surfaces. In the forend knuckle,the bottom of the "L" sets it as the cocking rod moves forward.The top then rises to catch the ejector hammer.The last surface is at the top of the knuckle and projects to the rear.As the barrels open,the last surface rides in its groove in the action knuckle.When the action groove ends,the sear trips.Check the two grooves on the action and check the two trip surfaces on the forend knuckle (they should be the same).

Mr Apperson; thanks for your advice. Both grooves on the action look the same and have no dirt nor debris inside either groove. The trip ends of the ejector sears both look the same. with no wear and not bent, etc. More information, I went to the range and shot again. The left barrel ejector hammer cocks and works just fine when the gun is dry fired without shells. Its timing seems perfect. But when firing one shell in the left barrel, no shell in the right, the left ejector hammer does not eject at all. It acts like an extractor. Seems like its jarring off when the gun is fired. Looking at the bottom of the "L" on the left ejector sear, the leg of the L is bent upward toward the barrels very slightly. It's not at exactly 90 degrees. Next I took the wood off the fore end metal and put the bare piece on the gun to see whats up. The top of the left sear seems to move nicely into the knotch on the hammer when the barrel is dry fired. It doesn't look like a tiny hair trigger engagement. But that only simulates the dry fire setup. Any other ideas from this informatoin would be greatly would be appreciated.

Next step. Bend the "L" to 90 degrees.Take the wood off.Install the forend.Shoot the gun. Left first.Watch the movement of the parts.Tell me. Bill

Bill, thank you. Too late to do that today but I will do tomorrow as soon as I get a break from Christmas prep.

Meawhile, I did another test with wood off the fore end metal, everything assembled. Pushed on Right barrel ejector sear right on the L shaped section at its bottom. Nice easy movement and a little click from the sear spring.

Pushed on Left barrel ejector sear on its L shaped section, same test as the other one. Some movement but not as much as the Right one, Left sear is somewhat tight, no click from the spring.

Two pictuers before I do any thing. 1st one is the "L" shaped ends of the ejector sears. Left barrel one is on the left with blue ink on it. It looks like it is bent inward toward front of the fore end metal see the gap below it and how it is larger than the same opening on the right sear. Now, should I disassemble and bend it back out so the gap is the same on both?

2nd picture shows the top of the sears, the surface that engages the knotch in the ejector hammer. Left barrel one -bad one, is on the left. Its right hand edge is fuller than left hand edge that does the engaging in the knotch. Left side is worn a little bit. Should I make the right egde true with the left side or leave it alone?

First, make sure that the sears snap up and down firmly as the little piano wire springs,or at least the left one, may be worn or broken.If that is not the problem, then the leg of the left sear needs to match the right one. The top of the sear that engages the hammer engages more to the center,but while the sears are out of the forend you can even the surface.My guess is that the bottom leg is in too far and when the hammer falls and the cocking rod moves forward, the sear does not rotate fully up.Cold bending is tricky and you may wish to use heat.A new left sear from Galazan is $75 plus shipping. So,go slowly. The little piano wire springs are $5. I make my own from spring wire.

Mr. Apperson, between house guests I bent the L very slightly and reassembled. Shot the gun this afternoon and still have the same problem, left barrel sear works just fine when dry fired, but ejector hammer isn't cocked when a shell is fired. I am thinking the knotch in the ejector hammer is worn and-or angle is not sharp enough to hold it when the gun recoils. Another picture below shows how the sear does engage the knotch when dry fired. Does the worn knotch make sense? Also one question please -does the tip of the cocking rod just impact on the L section and drive it forward to set the sear? Or does the tip of the cocking rod bear against the L section and keep pushing it in place until the gun is opened after firing? Thank you for your valuable help. Joe

From the picture, relieve the sear so the the top engages the hammer notch better. 6 to 9 file strokes should make the bottom angle to the rear. The cocking rod only rotates the sear on impact. As the gun opens, the cocking cams immediately push the cocking rods to the rear.
Bill

Joe,
Something you should look at is to see if the forend loop is loose on the barrels' and has slid forward a bit. Look closely and gently tap fore and aft with a soft hammer on the loop and see if it moves. It can cause the problems you mention.