Jack, where do you see me trying to "refute a general proposition"? All I've said--and with which, by the way, you agree--is that the "general proposition" of universal health care does not mean that each and every universal health care plan is a good one. (See, once again, your own disapproval of the Obama and Clinton plans.) So what you're trying your best to do, Jack, is to sell a "general proposition" which may well not be generally beneficial in its specific implementation. That's why I'm asking for a specific plan--because you've already admitted that simply buying into the general proposition does not automatically lead to a good universal health care plan. (Reference, once more, Obama and Clinton.)

You're offering us a poke without describing the pig concealed therein. Please describe the pig if you expect to make the sale.

As for BS, I know it when I smell it. It's a bit different from HS (substitute hog for bull), with which I'm quite familiar, living as I do within half a mile of two large hog confinements. But pretty much the same odor wafts from the nonspecific pig concealed within the poke you're touting.