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Joined: Jul 2007
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 69 |
They are Webley & Rogers "Screwgrips" per Webley & Brain patent No. 3053 of 1882. (Sometimes called "Jolly Rogers" by Scott-trained gunmakers.) Made initially by P Webley for the trade, then successor Webley & Scott. They do have back-action locks. At a time when a "best" bar-action London SLE would be 60 guineas, these might have been 50, give or take a few pounds. There are tons of guns like these out there (many Evans included), not all made to this standard of fit & finish, though.
The higher grades, with fences such as these, are (can be) excellent guns. "These guns don't appear to be screw grips." William Evans PairOn what basis would you say they (Wm Evans pair) are not screw-grips or, more specifically, not W&R patent guns?
Last edited by Blackadder; 03/10/08 08:25 AM.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,457 Likes: 88
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,457 Likes: 88 |
Look at the 1914 Catalog where it shows the screw grip...then look at the Evans pair.
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,383 Likes: 2
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,383 Likes: 2 |
I much prefer term "breasts", but will readily admit "fences" is better than BALLS!  Not sure what was made at the shop of "Best Pencil Pusher from Purdey's", but I would go with: Boss, Beasley or Atkin every time. Not all is bad, in fact, I have heard many say Evans place is among the most friendly shops to visit. That's even if you don't order gun from them. 
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Joined: Jul 2007
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 69 |
I am, HJ, bottom of page 20 of the catalog in question. (The gun at top of same page, without screw-grip top extension, obviously is not a screw grip, and is not priced as one.)
The screw-grip gun at bottom of page has same pin placement as Evans and does not show the top extension, as the gun is closed. Obviously the example in catalog has one.
There are two basic types of screw-grip top extensions; the doll's head variant and a straight, stepped extension. The ones I've owned had doll's head.
Am I missing something you are seeing?
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Joined: Dec 2001
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,304 Likes: 222 |
Blackadder, they have all the marks of a screwgrip. Typical from all I have seen.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 69
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 69 |
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,457 Likes: 88
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,457 Likes: 88 |
I printed the catalog...there's a diagram of the Webley screw grip.
There is no extension on it that I can see. The "screw grip" looks to be a hidden third fastener to me.
The Evans guns look more like the earlier Scott Triplex Lever grip.
In the catalog they refer to side clips as "wings".
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,304 Likes: 222
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,304 Likes: 222 |
All the screwgrips I have seen are doll's heads extending into the arc of the top lever. It's hard for me to visualize a hidden fastener extending back far enough to contact the screw threads in the toplever spindle. Can you show the picture of the "hidden screwgrip" ?
Last edited by Daryl Hallquist; 03/10/08 01:08 PM.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,457 Likes: 88
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,457 Likes: 88 |
It's on page 10 of the Webley & Scott catalog http://rbsiii.com/nitro_express/Webley%20&%20Scott%201914%20Catalog.pdfThere's a picture of a Webley Screw grip gun on page 9...use the zoom tool to check it out. Check out the third fastener on the W & C Scott on page 19..picture 196 On page 24 on one of Scotts cheaper hammer guns there appears to be a dolls head with a screw grip. I'm beginning to think God only knows the variations in the guns made by Scott. I've got a 1915 Scott Sidelock that doesn't appear in the 1914 catalog in exact form. One thing I am sure of those Evans originally posted were not common screw gripped actioned back locks.
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,304 Likes: 222
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,304 Likes: 222 |
Homeless, I am a bit confused . I have opened and viewed the catalog you reference, but do not see the guns you reference on the pages you suggest.
On Page 10, I see a top rib extension with Greener type cross bolts with either square or round bolts. No screw grip there.
On Page 9 , I see the Premier Hammer gun with the Scott Improved bolt which is a Greener type , rectangular, cross bolt. No screw grip there.
On Page 19, I see a plain quality Greener gun with a rib extension, but no screw grip.
On Page 24 , there is a falling block action-----no screw grip
Is it possible you referenced the wrong catalog ?
Last edited by Daryl Hallquist; 03/10/08 03:28 PM.
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