doublegunshop.com - home Forums Thread Like Summary - 20 ga. 1 oz. reload suggestions

So, my "new" quail gun is regulated for slow 1 oz. loads, at about 1100-1150 fps. Dean Harris determined this for me. I thought, no problem, I'll just reload them. Got plenty of everything already on hand. Or, so I thought.

Tried the recipes in Lyman handbook for 17 gr. 7625 and for 15.5 gr. Unique. Using a WAA20 wad for an old style WW compression formed hull, as called for, it won't work. No way to crimp with a full 1 oz. shot in there, too full. It appears I need a shorter wad. Any ideas or suggestions? Only hulls on hand are the old style WW compression formed.

Please, no recommendations for less than an ounce of shot, or m.v. above 1165 fps.

Thanks, SRH

Prof, It does not really matter if a few bits of powder migrate as long as the shells are consistent in velocity and pressure. Some powders are better than others for migrating and the small ball or semi ball powders have always been know for migrating by the wad seal to some extent. It was a real problem with some .410 wads to the point that you had to increase the powder drop when using old empties. About 15 years ago I had several different hulls tested and found that after two reload I had to increase the powder drop by .7-1.2 grains to keep velocity up. It was caused by increased internal volume in the hull and greater powder migration with the orange PC wad being the worst, but still it gave the most consistent loads for velocity and pressure. After that I stopped worrying too about powder migration and decided velocity and pressures were more of a concern. Keep them as close to the same as possible and getting good patterns. I wondered at the time if the migrated powder did not still get fully burned up anyways and expect it mostly does. If the powder gets by the seal I expect a bit of fire does to burn the powder as well or as the wad exits the hull then the migrated powder should burn. So I load straight wall hulls with wads that may not prevent powder migration if they preform well in testing and patterning.

I loaded 5,000 Fiocchi 12 gauge hulls trimmed down to 67mm to shoot in both 2 1/2" and 2 3/4" guns. Loaded with Unique powder, load was 1 1/8 ounce, 1200 feet at 6400psi and a 1 1/16 ounce load which was slightly lower pressure. Loaded about 2,500 of each load. I had them tested, the loads that is, before I mass produced them on my Spolar loader. They were almost on the money, with extreme velocity variation of 35 fps in one and 16 in the other. Pressure varied more than velocity and the highest pressures did not relate to the highest velocity. The 1 1/16 is a really nice load that will even cycle a semi auto for my daughter in law, who shoots a Benelli SB3. In a SxS or pump it is a pleasure to shoot. I might just load only that load with 1 1/16 as it crimps nicely with out issues and seems to get the job done.

I no longer worry about what to shoot, if I want to shoot any 12 bore I have, from a 1860's Westley Richards hammer gun to modern gun. I just reach for a box of these Fiocchi and shoot without worry. They fit everything, are a safe moderate pressure and a decent velocity for any clay target. And I only load Fiocchis with these two low pressure loads, with common wads, a easily obtained powder and primers and used a standard crimp so no special loading issues. I have another 10,000 once fired hulls which I got for less than a penny each. When these 5,000 are shot up then I will load another 5,000. I even have 16 pounds of Unique I bought just before Alliant started increasing prices through the roof. Other than hunting loads in 12 gauge I am set for a year maybe in 12 gauge.

Gil, I remember that issue well because I fired a blooper at a big gobbler with one. That was an unusual experience. The primer had enough power to lob the shot towards him, but it all landed before getting to him. He didn't know what had happened, but didn't hang around very long.

The issue wasn't a wad in this case; it was a gas seal sold by BPI that was placed over the powder and under the wad. For some reason, they put 2 holes in the "seal" that allowed quite a bit of the W296 to pass through it, leaving an air pocket to cause the blooper. I thought I was just unlucky, but I took the rest of the shells apart and nearly all of them would have misfired after being carried on just one hunting trip. The load works great if you fill the holes with fingernail polish or something similar.

Stan, I've had good results using Longshot in a 1 oz 20 gauge load, though it is a little faster than what you need. It sounds like you have solved your problem anyway. It's always amazing to me how very small changes in your shells can have such an effect on POI with a SxS. Try regulating a light field gun to shoot 1-5/8 oz turkey loads if you wanna have some fun. 😊

Hunted this afternoon from 3:00 to nearly dark with the Sterly 20 and some of the Win. Super X Heavy Game loads. First covey flushed a little wild and I took the first shot with the "new to me" gun at about 20 yards with the .006" barrel. I knew I was on the bird and it folded cleanly. Next shot was with the .016" barrel at nearly 30 yards, and dropped it too. When the dogs were retrieving the birds they brought in two birds from the first shot. My friend, who was behind me, said he saw the two birds drop on the first shot. I thought, "3 for 2 is a pretty good start".

The 1 oz. at 1165 fps shells worked well the rest of the afternoon. No cripples were lost. If I was on the bird it fell. I took a total of seven this afternoon. I think I'm gonna like the shells, and I know I like my "new" Sterly quail gun. Thanks, Bobby.

If I just had my old eyes back. Can't pick out a single bird in the gathering dusk as quickly as I used to.

SRH

When I got the gun I took it straight to the grease plate and tried it with 7/8 oz. loads. It crossfired pretty bad. I tried a couple different brands. Same deal.

I called Dean and asked him if he could move the patterns that much (can't remember how many inches, but I'm guessing it was around 8 inches. I think I mentioned it in another thread. I'll try to find it.) He said send it and he'd try. He called me back after he'd shot the gun and said all it needed was slow 1 oz. loads, and regulated fine with them. So, he just opened the chokes and lengthened the chamber for me.

I'm happy.

You need the (yellow) WAA20F1 wad for 1 ounce loads in the compression formed AA 20-gauge case.

The Winchester Ball Powder loading guide says Win 209, 21.5 grains of 540, WAA20F1, 1 ounce of shot, goes 1165 fps.

Turkey hunter-handloaders have reported bloopers caused by migrating powders with some wads made by BP. However these were most likely shells carried over from season to season in someone's pocket. I believe the wad, nomenclature escapes me, was a 20 ga. wad with two small openings in the gas seal the purpose of which was unknown to me. I avoided the wad. Gil