Does anyone know who patent W.S.R. refers to? I acquired a 16 English hammer gun, back action, and stamped on the action flats is WSR Patent in a circle with 122 below. I looked to no avail in the books i have but could not locate who this refers to.

Thanks,

John

Possibly William Spinks Riley of The Eagle Gun Works, Vauxhall Street, Birmingham. Seems to have been a prolific inventor during the hammer gun era. Here are three snippets I found in The British Shotgun, 1850-1870. Oh, the number 122 is probably the use number.

If you could post good closeup photos of the action and barrel lugs it would help.

Joe,

Many thanks for the information. I will post photos of the action and barrel flats. The second photo paragraph seems on the mark. The pins or strokers are spring loaded.

John

John, as I understand it, the reference you make is not for a spring on the firing pin but rather a pin set on top of the barrel to indicate if the gun was loaded. Could be wrong though.

Might look at this thread and gun. It has spring loaded load indicators and has pictures of a gun with several Riley patents.

http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbt...true#Post321683

Bob, that is an excellent link.......the trail grows warmer. Oh, beautiful gun!

Glad it helped...thank

Joe and Bob,

Thanks for the link and photo. I will take some digital pics and post as soon as the semester is over. This gun does not have the same nipple/strikers as the that in Bob's pics. They may have been changed over the course of a century and the patent number on the barrel flats is number 122. Could this be for the lock up rather than the strikers. I saw a similar lock up on Vinatgeguns Uk web site, a back action with a protrusion on the rear lump or lug that extends under and into the breech face.

John

Page 75 of the DGJ, Summer 2014 has some good pics and info on WSR .

As I understand it (and welcome correction) what one thinks is a patent number is often a license usage number issued by the patent holder. In this case 122 might be just such an instance.

Joe, you are correct. It is one way the patent holder was able to keep track of the payments due, by applying a use number on the guns. Westley Richards even demanded the guns using one of their patents be brought by for their inspection and marking prior to the guns being sold by others.

Daryl,would there be any records of these inspections or payments still intact?

There exist handwritten contracts between Anson/Deeley and Westley Richards, and later between Westley Richards and other English and one American maker. I owned about a dozen of these contracts, but recently sold them to a writer. I would assume that I did not have all of the contracts of this type. They dated from the mid 1870s to the later 1890s.

Thanks, I am trying to trace the history of a gun with A&D patent # and I guess that this line of inquiry won't pan out.

Daryl,

Thanks much for the reference. I read the DGJ article and saw the pics w/the WSR patents. One for the forend release and another for the lock up. Should i assume following the article that the WSR on the action flats of my gun refers to the lock up/ bolting system. It differs significantly from the DGJ gun and as noted above closely resembles the back action example on the Vintagegunsuk web site.

John

Pictures would help us answer your questions. Daryl

I missed that DGJ article on W.S. Riley, have to find that one. I have a W.S. Riley, #7,008. There was a thread on the old Internet Gun Club site that answered a few questions I had on it. I'm not a member there anymore and can't view the threads. This gun was where the IGC got the spread eagle logo and banner with "Nothing Without Labour". I can't recall, but I think it may have also provided the name of his shop, Eagle Gun Works. Quite a few patents mentioned in this, including what I'm told is Parson's chopper lump hammer mark. Well made with London proofmarks. I'll just post some photos.

Sorry, I looked up an old post for info and accidentally posted a reply on the old thread. Please ignore.