I am interested in the differences between Ithaca and Miller single selective triggers. I have seen a drawing of an Ithaca trigger on this site but would like to see side by side images of the triggers so that i might be able to tell which my 1931 NID contains. I know that Ithaca used Miller triggers up to 1931 and then changed to a design of their own.

Thanks

jlb

Ithaca factory trigger. 1927 NID, 20ga, 3E, single selective trigger, 3 position tang selector/safety.

Walt or someone else will have to tell you what/who designed it. I think it's a Miller design, alleged stolen by Ithaca.

Chuck, here's a Miller trigger. It my understanding that before Ithaca built their own single trigger, that Miller supplied them to Ithaca guns. I seem to remember that the first Miller on Ithaca triggers had the Miller name on them, and later the same trigger was supplied without the Miller name. Finally, Ithaca produced their own trigger. It is possible that the trigger you show is actually a Miller, without the name.

It is my understanding that Miller did the work himself and not sold his trigger to anyone else. He installed them, so you sent the gun to him. That includes L.C. Smith's as well.
The early Miller One Trigger had the selector on the safety and worked like a three position safety, rearward, left barrel, forward, right. Later they were put along side the triggers.

David, you are correct as I know it. I did not phrase my answer very well. I should have said Miller installed [not supplied] the single trigger of Miller design. I seem to remember the friction between Miller and Ithaca was partly because Ithaca charged more for the Miller trigger than it would cost when Miller sold a trigger to an Ithaca owner.

Daryl, I wouldn't doubt that. If Dan May sees this he could tell us everything we need to know about them.

There is some information on the Ithaca/Lefever/Western Arms single triggers in this thread:

http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=418044

John

Daryl,

I am unable to open the image file you submitted to the forum. Would you be willing to repost or to send the image to me by PM?

thanks

jlb

Photobucket seems down today. Patience, I guess

I took a picture at the shop today to show a side by side comparison but can't share until photobucket comes back up.

Standby....

Harry Howland received Patent No. 1,818,852 on Aug. 11, 1931, and assigned it to Ithaca Gun Company --

As promised:

[img:left][/img]

The trigger on the left is an Ithaca factory "Howland" patent trigger. The right is a traditional Miller trigger with the 1962 patent selector (not from an Ithaca,however). The ONLY difference between the Howland and Miller trigger is in the trigger body. Howland made the trigger body two pieces instead of one, the pieces pinned together at the front. This accomplishes exactly nothing in either form or function but it allowed them to get around the Miller patent. All of the actual functioning principles are the same between the two triggers. I actually feel the two piece trigger body makes them harder to regulate because it adds a whole dimension of unnecessary movement into the mechanism that must be accounted for.

The two triggers are easy to tell apart once you've seen the difference in the trigger bodies.

Hope this helps!

Best regards, Dan

Dan

Thank you for the images of the triggers. I truly appreciate you effort in this regard.

jlb