This huge, 500 page book, came to me a few years ago. It is written by Nicholas Niles, Jr. and is a real effort. When I received it some years ago, I thought it was maybe semi valuable and it got buried in my book stacks. The last few days I have some time and pulled the book out and sat on the deck and read it for a few hours. That's what it is about-----affordable American shotguns, but I am finding the history of same quite interesting. There are latterly thousands of names and brands in the book, all put into some decent order, which is hard to do. If any of you like older American shotguns, mostly made to sell at a lower price, you will like this. If not, the history of the American Arms Industry is quite interesting.

I have that book also I think it is amazing lots of research went into that book. GREAT BOOK

Check out ALBRIS Book selling for $62.00

I agree that there is a lot of information in the book but it is perhaps one of the most poorly written and edited manuscripts I've ever seen in print. The organization is basically non-existent, the author repeats himself constantly and his amateurish forced use of capitalization and quotation marks around otherwise common terms is maddening. If ever there was an argument against self-publishing, this is it. This was an author in desperate need of an editor.

Otherwise, it's great.

bladeswitcher, your thoughts are good. I first handled it and put it down, but yesterday, with maybe more interest in those things, I picked it up again and enjoyed the immense effort and research that went into it.

I can forgive self published books and bow to the effort put into them and the cost of publishing. I try to buy EVERY book on our subject that the authors put out. I am sure not many make any money for their efforts.

In that vein, I just ordered Old Wildfowler's book, Pte. Mouillee Shooting Club, History, Decoys, Nate Quillin, Punt Guns, and look forward to seeing it.

I own the book but find it maddening to try to use. It's one thing to read a chapter and try to absorb what the author is saying. It's something else to try to use the book as a reference. I've had occasions when someone presented me with an old shotgun and I turned to Niles' book to find some information. Talk about a frustrating experience.

The writing itself isn't so bad (though it's not particularly good, either), but the editing is terrible. There is no adherence to standard rules of style. He mixes up capitalization, italics, bold face fonts and quotation marks in seemingly random and unnecessary ways. Particularly annoying is his practice of capitalizing and enclosing in quotations the word "Affordable" throughout the book. I suppose he believes he's created a new category of firearm and wants to milk it for all it's worth. Drives me crazy . . .

Again, if ever there was an author in need of an editor. The savings in paper and printing cost alone would have paid for a good editor's services.

ETA: I'm curious, have others found the author's research credible? Seems like he engages in a lot of speculation.

I have the book. Could it have been better? Yes. Does it engage in a lot of speculation? In places, yes. Look back at the works from Carder and Vorisek. They also tossed around speculation. Thats what you do when no records remain. I have read through my copy of Niles' work three times. It was written by an enthusiast that did his best from his home office to convey his study. Several of the manufacturers get little coverage, but what Nick, I believe, really clarifies are the guns manufacturered by the Crescent Fire Arms Co. and its' history. There are at least 12 variations of the Crescent hammer sidelocks, and the book separates them all chronologically, by design features, and a quite close estimate (read that speculation) of serial number by variant. These were the guns sold to the masses. And Nick, may not be the author we were expecting, but he made the attempt. I think it was a good one.

John

If you would like to read a well written, IMO, self published book, get a copy of J P Clabrough by Larry Shelton. I understand it took him a long long time to research and write.

Very interesting read for any English shotgun enthusiast.

Your characterization is certainly more generous and fair than mine. You're right, the author deserves a lot of credit for the work he's done. I just wish he had hired an editor. (In the interest of full disclosure, I was a publication editor for 20+ years so I'm probably more offended by the stylistic things than most readers).

"Affordable" is a rather ephemeral and loosely defined term when we're talking about our doubles. What is affordable to me may well be totally out of reach to a young guy with a crappy job, several kids, and a mortgage. But it might seem like bottom feeding to someone in the upper income brackets. I skimmed though the book about 10 years ago at a gun show and didn't buy it then for an asking price of $20.00, as I recall. it was disorganized. But I'd buy a copy for a reasonable price today, given the chance, just to have access to a listing of obscure names and makers.



On the other hand... it appears that you may have discovered that ed good is the real author of this book.

Our book was self published but we have a very good editor, a great graphic artist and it was printed in Michigan NOT CHINA

Who said it was?

I think the potential problems of self publishing can be chosen to be overlook. I can't speak about this book, but I think traditional publishers would turn down such narrow focus, likely low volume pieces. I think there are many very good examples of books that the time and effort put in could never be recovered other than some satisfaction. There are many believable stories of research, notes and manuscripts lost when someone passes on. Now, self publishing may be an option.

How many decades ago did we only have Bob Hinman's Golden Age of Shotguns ? When this book was written, that's all we had. When the douglegunshop bbs, which had another name, started, this book was used to answer many questions. Now, we never hear about it. The internet has progressed so that there are so many more learned shotgun lovers. The Niles book is the best since then, covering way more than Hinman did. Of course there are errors and left outs, and I see them in my limited specialty interests. But, the book is of great value to collectors. I would rate "something to say" ahead of great pictures, great editing , and where the book was published. I really don't care about pictures with tobacco pipes, tweeds, and maybe a few dried leaves. Also don't care about paragraphs full of little research, both of which we get in magazines nowadays, but informercials of how we can get there.

Ed Muderlak, (I presume after his illness was diagnosed) Posted right here where the specialty gun book publishing system was, and the direction it was headed in. Over a decade ago.

He was prescient beyond measure on the matter.

I buy some self published books, No e-books, and often wish people would spring for some editing of their treasures.

RIP Ed.
And thanks for your hard work.

Now I feel bad. I guess I'm just the guy standing on the outside throwing rocks at the guy in the arena.

Niles' book is definitely chock full of information. So much information that it sometimes feels like trying to drink from a fire hose. There are so many charts and lists that you don't know where to turn. It's sort of like a library with all the books tossed on the floor.

I guess what I'm saying is while the information is great, it could have been better if it were presented more coherently.

bladeswicher, I understand your point. But I do not wish, in any way, to discourage anyone from writing about our interests. I run across many "writers" who cannot afford the time to do research for an article, because a deadline approaches. I give big hugs to a fellow who sits at his desk, compiles a lifetime of research, and ends up with "something to say". It may not be in the best form, but is worth much more than good form, with very little to say.

I wonder what a decent editing service or editor would cost. It seems to make a difference if the editor is familiar with the topic. I can recall conversing with a fellow that published a few books that're known but likely have a narrow audience. He mentioned having a final draft of a second edition to one of his earlier books ready to go, but he didn't want to spring for the several thousand dollars it was going to cost at his advanced age. I thought at the time that wasn't much to hold up the project, but paying an editor might have doubled the cost?

I would bet you could find a "readability" editor on any college campus for 20$/hr.
They would find all the misspellings, incorrect word choices, and corrupted sentences etc, pretty quckly.
For good research structure, that's a kind of wrote formatting, taught in MA studies of English literature or Writing.

My kid is a Legislation Editor down at our state capital, she bill's out at about 75$/hr.

I bet you could clean up enough in one visit to make a book easier to use as a reference. Indices, biblio, etc.

I caught the double fever here in (I think) 1985, started buying American doubles, a Parker among them and bought Peter H. Johnson's "Parker, America's Finest Shotgun." I took away from comments on the book that assistance would have been a big improvement.

It's a mystery to me why any author wouldn't ask another for criticism of a manuscript. Is it accurate? How about structure? Have I qualified properly those long reaches of opinion? Members here with ample skills would probably do it pro bono.

That's what friends are for. I'd put my manuscript into the hands of a person with general knowledge of the subject and the art of plain talk before an "editor" any day.

King, I think in most cases, a fee for service Editor would provide a better, more dependable, product than a friend.

When I hear of editing issues, I am reminded of the Sauer tome that was somebody's 2000 page life's work that was quickly panned by people as soon as it was published. A good editing might have turned that one into a "bible" for German gun fans.

Made me smile a bit CZ. You do know what happens when you hire a "readability" editor at a local college campus? It seems like like a tough spot between hoping to break even and going in the hole. I wonder if the next book gets put on hold if an author has to clear out their $129.95 pride and joy for twenty bucks. I don't know if it's so easy.

keet: you solved da miss tre an won da prize...you been selected to edit mah book...for dis priv ledge, please send ten hun dred dollars bills, to cover in surance, shippin and handlin, to me, care of:

the right reverend billie saul harkus
po box 44 special
del rio, texas 78840

upon receipt of funds, ah will
send you ah dvd of the text in word processing format for your
edit and review...keet...ah am so happy for you an am so glad hit were you dat were so cleaver an earned dis rare opportunity...

king: always best to leave the first edition of a new reference publication with a few flaws, omissions, and errors...that way, the nit pickers will tell you lots of what you already know...and they will also tell you what you dont know...soon as the info flow ebbs, you can then come out with a new addition...if you play it right you can really milk this revenue stream for a long time...

In most cases, talking of self-publishing, you're right. Most anyone can clean up copy, though, friend or not. Professional writers I know, including an American National Book Award winner with a new unpublished work of historical fiction, have no ego when it comes to passing along their work for criticism to friends with distinguished credentials. I've often thought there are dozens of members who could produce a successful gun book for the general market from contributions here, if they put their mind to it.

king: it already exists in digital form, including pictures...its called google search...

here is an example:

reilly shotgun search revealed this:

https://www.google.com/search?q=reilly+s...me&ie=UTF-8

absolutely amazing the knowledge we have at our fingertips...

Ed, I'd much rather proof-read or edit the fictitious book that King Brown told us about a few months ago... you know, the one he said he was collaborating on with someone else in order to change the public's attitudes towards firearms.

I didn't believe that cock-and bull nonsense when he posted it, and considering the sheer volume of anti-2nd Amendment and anti-NRA rhetoric he has posted here... I sure as hell don't believe it now. If he ever actually did write such a book, I'd hope that he would elaborate upon this wild-assed story:



Remember, up until the time Robert F. Kennedy was assassinated, Security for U.S. Presidential Candidates was virtually non-existent. The Secret Service was not involved at all. Security at the Ambassador Hotel where Bobby was killed was a handful of rental cops from Ace Guard Service. But some here, including you Ed, believe his bullshit.

really good bull shit is very believeable...

Never heard of the book before. Had little interest in these "affordable" guns and passed them up at shows. But curiosity got the best of me and bought a used copy on line. I agree with the above comments that reading the book can be disorienting. You have to try to digest it in small bites. I read the chapter on Folsom since I was given one many decades ago. (Traded it for a Hollis 12 gauge with a broken hammer and thought I got the better of the deal).

There is a tremendous amount of information that I doubt you can find anyplace else. I learned the "Smithsonian" is a Folsom gun and not a museum piece. Niles passed away in 2012. There is an obituary on line. It would have been a real loss if this knowledge had passed with him. Keeping my eye out for a Knickerbocker No. 6.

It appears the Book got published the year of Nicholas Niles' death. There may have been some hurry getting it done. I hope he got to see the finished product , which his obituary calls his life's work. Thanks, Mr. Niles

Everyone has a different style of research. Some peruse old magazines, others turn to the census records. Larry's approach is very unique. He ferrets out living descendants of his research target. He then sits with them and listens.

I have nothing but high regard for him and his results.

Pete

Well, geez, now I feel REALLY bad . . . .

Don't worry about it switchblade, honest criticism is what makes things better...Geo