Much like Ted and his Minnesota pheasants, instead of listening to the news (and rest of the shrieking haradans!) I try to keep busy with more-traditional (cis-gendered) pursuits. Processing part of an elk in the garage today (I've got a little time on my hands, & my younger buddy who killed it last Monday doesn't) and slowly filling my truck with the usual materials needed to roll up into the high & lonely to chase ungulates again. Blessed with both an elk and a deer tag this year(!). Picked up my son from collage yesterday and he's very interested in joining-in. He didn't happen to pull a tag this year but his strong back and clear eyes will be a significant asset. I'd picked up a flu-bug just after getting home from the North Country in mid-October and it has taken forever (better part of 4-weeks) to get over the darn thing, but just in the last week I'm feeling myself again so....back at it! So looking forward to having my rifle in my hands and good country to walk in. Counting all my blessings here today.

Lloyd,
Here's wishing you a great trip and hunt. Stay safe and healthy! Keep posting those pictures.
Karl

Sounds good Lloyd. Have at it!

Had my first cold/flu/bug thing in years this fall, after the wife brought it home from the elementary school she teaches at. It knocked her on her ass for five days or so, nothing like that for me, but, it did feature a persistent, snotty, cough. Kid might have had a runny nose for a day.
It did impact hunting season. But, there is plenty of work to do prepping for winter, on mine and my brothers property. Him being in the nursing home has given me another home to care for.
The last of my Father’s deer rifles came to live at my house a few weeks past. They are my brothers, technically, but, truth be told, a double amputee isn’t likely to need them, any time soon. I didn’t want to leave them in the unoccupied house. I have four deer rifles on site, and I think I fired one of them, one time, circa 1981.

I never caught the big game bug. I get it, I just don’t do it.

Give the boy my regards, and you two have safe travels, there and back. I have a to die for chili recipe that calls for elk or antelope, or, better yet, both, but, I haven’t had either in a few years. Made it with moose last time, any of the above makes a fine meal.

Happy trails, Lloyd.

Best,
Ted

Glad to hear you're on the mend, Ted. Have had both the last Covid booster and my flu shot. So far have avoided the bug. A friend who listened to his pharmacist and had both shots on the same day advised not to do that. He ended up with chills alternating with sweats for a couple days.

I'm with you on the big game deal. When I was a kid in Iowa, we didn't have enough deer to hunt, so I didn't grow up pursuing big game. My only experience along those lines: Shot a couple of wild boars in Morocco. Driven hunts organized by tribes in the mountains. Shotguns only over there. I used 00 buck the first time. Discovered that was not a good idea. My first one was a relatively small pig, but those critters have tough hides. Pellets barely penetrated. Went to slugs the 2nd time.

Blessings on you and son, Lloyd. Strike while the iron is hot. The days come, for all of us, when because of age related things and various reasons we are more reticent to embark on long, or adverse, hunts. Memories of previous hunts can be with us through those times, however.

I'm considering a 4 day hunt in old Mexico with a friend, for ducks, doves and quail, in January. I will most likely say no to it, tho'. Not because I don't feel able or wouldn't enjoy it, but because of the worry it would cause my wife. Over our lifetime together I have been her rock, not in a bragging way, but because she has depended on me for so much over our lifetime together that she worries more now about what it would be like for her to be left without me. Drug cartels are a real thing in the region we would be going to, and she knows that. After nearly losing me a little over two years ago I just don't want to put her through that worry again, even for a few days. Argentina would be much different, and I'd like to go there again, but Mexico gives us pause.

Do the natives in Morocco eat the pigs, Larry? When I was in France, the recent immigrants, in addition to not being interested in being Frenchman, learning the French language, and totally uninterested in pursuing typical French pastimes, wanted absolutely nothing to do with the pigs that were overrunning the place. Herve’ hit a 700 pounder, with his car one night a few months before I got there.
Little French cars don’t do so well against big pigs. Nobody got hurt, but, that was luck.

Best,
Ted

Hope it goes well Lloyd- Good Hunting!

Yeah Lloyd, it's a wonderful time of the year. I'm busily trying to wrap up yard work, getting studded snow tires mounted on vehicles, oiling undersides to protect against road salt, and of course, prepping for our deer rifle season opener next weekend. It's supposed to be nice and sunny tomorrow, so I'll go out back to sight in the flintlock and the .45-70.

It was 17 degrees here this morning, not far from your hometown, and the ground had snow cover ... as further proof of global warming. I hear they had around 4 feet of lake effect snow near Buffalo a few days ago. The leaves seemed to drop a bit sooner than usual this year, making visibility in the woods great, but grouse were still very scarce in Venango and Clarion County. However, a buddy told me that they were more plentiful than he's seen in many years in Potter County, so hopefully the population loss is finally turning around. I got a doe tag for 2F, so will probably spend some time hunting in Forest County next week. This is why I save a lot of my vacation time for the end of the year. Happy hunting.

Gentlemen, thank you all!

Ted, you really should join me some time with one of your father's rifles. The high & lonely and a very good rifle were essentially made for each other (the scenery doesn't suck either!) and it's something we should consider while good country remains and moreover...before time sneaks up on us. The beautiful thing about bird hunting is the forgiving nature of it can allow for a long-extended career (well into the 80s for many & perhaps... even further?). The last elk I humped out of the back country was really talking to me at the end of that job and... I know my days are numbered for that sort of experience (very few elk hunters go much past 70-75). Thankfully, deer are far-easier (maybe not quite as easy as feathers?) and I'm hopeful that I've still got some time left for that one. Think about it.

Last November...

I’ll consider it. One of the elements of hunting, for me, is the dog. If I didn’t have a damn dog, I might not hunt.

The invite is noted, and appreciated. Yea, rifles that don’t have a purpose are thick on the ground, here, right now. Guessing the 30-30 and the .44 magnum carbine would stay home with the dog, and the 30-06 or the 7mm magnum would get the job.

I seem to recall watching Dad shoot the 7mm and thinking to myself “that looks unpleasant”.

Best,
Ted

There is not a great deal that the 7mm Remington Magnum can do that a .30/06 cannot.

True.

My dad had hoped to travel west to hunt pronghorn, and perhaps some other ungulates, and built the 7mm for that task. He never got further west than Aberdeen after he settled down and started collecting a Marine Corps pension.

The rifle is basically new.

The 30-06 is the 742 version of the Remington Speedmaster, 1963 vintage. Basket weave wood, also mostly unused. Dad gravitated toward the Ruger .44 carbine I bought him for Christmas, in 1981.

Going west would give me the chance to put the 7mm to a use similar to what Dad wanted to do with it.

Best,
Ted

Ted,

I take it that the 7mm is a bolt action, and I agree it is likely to have an edge for long range work.

I have both and I’d have to concur. My 7mm is in a pre ‘64 style M70 action and my favorite rifle for the west. My -06 742 remains my favorite rifle for still hunting the Ozarks of my youth.

Lloyd, do you use one or two trekking poles? They really can be a huge help, especially going downhill and when carrying heavy loads, of course. With 3 knee surgeries behind me, I try to be proactive in preventing more damage. As an upside, it helps with a lot of leg and core fatigue. More than I would have guessed. I use a telescoping pair of Black Diamond carbon-fiber poles.

Your comment prompted me to fill out my coyote story from the rmb lock down thread. The friend of mine has a couple of decoy dogs, as good as any top bird dogs. They sit perfectly obedient, and when a coyote shows up, he sends them out, and they work like it's some sort of symphony. It aggitates they coyotes to no end, and others start to come out of the woodwork. They can't stand another canine on their turf, and drop their wariness. Bird hunting with a good dog reigns, but may the rmbs, and his criminal enabling, of this fine country be opposed at every moment. Ooops.

In thinking about “headed back out again” I think once more into the breech.

The moment we cease to get up and go we step closer to oblivion. Nothing is better for your soul than the urge to ruck up and go.

Good on you Lloyd.

My Dad’s rifles were his pride and joy:







The 7mm is a first year, with the stainless barrel. The carving of the deer in the stock is artful-I’m pretty sure the Japanese artisan had never actually seen a North American whitetail deer. Carvings in gun stocks are not to my taste, but, Dad wanted it. The checkering lady at Ahlman’s can convert the impressed checkering to cut checkering, but Dad didn’t see the need. The engraving cut in the steel and the aluminum floor plate is as nice as it gets. The barrel is finished in black chrome. The guns are laying on my Dad’s field coat, 1951 vintage, that the boy uses to this day.

The 30-06 is the gun he usually used until I bought him the Ruger. He took several deer with it in New Jersey, in 1962, after he fought like hell with the local CLEO, who didn’t think there was any reason a 31 year old, Marine Corp sniping instructor with 7th rifle corps needed a deer rifle for the two years he had left at that duty station. Dad’s CO begged to differ. Dad got his rifle and a new attitude about Easterners. Dad had one scope, a Bausch and Lomb Balvar, that he switched between the guns. No adjustments on the scope itself, they are on the mounts. Ahlman’s, for many years did a lot of work converting the 742 Remingtons to pump guns, after they got rusty chambers, and tore themselves apart trying to eject a spent cartridge. Dad’s chamber, of course, is clean.

I imagine either gun would suffice to kill deer out west. Still, it is sad my Dad never got a shot at that pronghorn he built the rifle to take. The autoloader seems to be more pleasant to actually shoot. Dad never shot the 7mm more than once or twice, but, he didn’t need to. He had a grasp of ballistics that no one I have ever met has had. He would ask “What weight bullet, how fast” and have the damn gun on target, first round, in the bull with the second round. He made it look easy.

Best,
Ted

Both rifles would clearly work, but the 7mm is more seemingly adapted to the vastness which defines western hunting. Growing up in the deciduous forests of Pennsylvania had me struggling to adapt to the rigors of hunting in the Western States when I first got here (back in the early 80s). My whole approach had to change, and with time (and a few successes) it did. Now I enjoy the blessings that both offer and would feel deprived if a year passed without either. As much as I like to walk with with a fine shogun, a walk with a good rifle is also very satisfying. The focus is completely different (far versus close) but the net effect is the same. Each is an adventure that is full of possibilities, and each still feels like a stolen moment (a guilty pleasure!). Modern life makes so-many demands upon us, to step out of that world is always refreshing, invigorating, and (at least for me) full of wonder at the natural world. It will be a sad day when I have to put my rifle away for the last time.

Keith,
What rifle do you have in 45-70?

Perry, I will probably carry my Marlin 1895 .45-70 on the first couple days of rifle deer season. But I also have a Siamese Mauser converted to .45-70, a Wickliffe 76 single shot in .45-70, and an 1886 Trapdoor Springfield. I haven't fired the Trapdoor yet because it was missing the rear sight when I bought it.

Early on, I was a disciple of Roy Weatherby, and strongly believed in smaller calibers at high velocity. But when I started hunting with a flintlock, I quickly learned that those large diameter bullets or balls at relatively low black powder velocity killed all out of proportion to their rather anemic kinetic energy. It didn't make sense on paper, but having every deer I shot with it fall dead within a very few yards convinced me otherwise.

To me, the major advantage of carrying the Marlin 1985 versus the flintlock is that the Marlin has a Leupold 1-4x scope. Since the advent of antler restrictions in my state, I missed out on a number of bucks with the flintlock simply because I had to take extra time and make additional arm movements while counting points with binoculars. But if I had to choose to keep only one hunting rifle for the rest of my life, it would be a flintlock... without a doubt. And Flintlock Season is my absolute favorite.

My experience very closely mirrors Keith's, only I began with a percussion m/l roundball rifle in '83. I found that a 237 gr. ball killed perfectly. When I bought a much used Ruger #3 in .45-70 and began reloading for it I used 300 gr. Rem. hollow points at 2100. There was a modest amount of recoil but it was manageable even for my 10 yr. old son who killed his first deer with it, and many more afterward. I sold it to buy a new Ruger #1 in the very same caliber, which I still have.

Those two rifles have taken scores of deer for him and me. All were anchored with one shot and all were recovered.

I think the big slow bullet observation is true for deer but, maybe not so much for elk. Muzzleloaders have the reputation for not killing elk so good. As do slug guns. A lot of elk have been killed with .45-70's but that monster can kill pretty much anything.

My theory is the little high velocity bullet doesn’t have enough depth to work with in a deer. Usually a pass through and a bigger hole is better. In the elk it tumbles and change course through the big chest cavity, often not exiting, causing much trauma. Maybe that’s why a long and skinny bullet like the 6.5 Creedmoor can be so effective on elk -even though it isn't particularly powerful. All the energy is expended inside the elk.

II had a Marlin 1895 Cowboy but sold it to a friend for his CAS long range rifle shooting. I kept the Marlin Alaskan Guide in wood and blue. I have hopes of shooting either a deer or an elk with the Pedersoli 45-70 Double Rifle I have or the Alaskan Guide. Of course, it is a matter of getting drawn here in NM. If not a deer or elk I would like to try it out on hogs in west Texas ( or anywhere a hunt is available). I subscribed to the smaller / faster bullets for years until I killed a deer with a rifled slug in an Ithaca Deer Slayer at just over 130 yards. Dropped him stone dead without him taking over one or two steps. That made me a believer in big chunks of lead thrown at moderate speeds at reasonable distance.

Way back when, I bought a box of 500 ga. RN bullets to load in the .45-70, just for grins. With guidance from the RCBS loading manual I loaded those little stogies to within 200 fps of what a .458 Win Mag shot the same bullet. It was fun to shoot offhand .......... not so much off the bench.

Elk aren't anything special and I've killed them with it. Along with moose, eland, pronghorn, oryx, hartebeast, deer, and more. They don't have to go fast either. The eland and other Africans were shot with a load that did not make 1200 fps. The others only a little bit faster. I have a handful of .45s because they work really, really well.

SKB probably has the ultimate elk muzzleloader, and it is gigantic. Maybe the builder did that for a reason. A few years ago, I chased an elk a long way and it turned out my buddy had made a good hit with a .50 cal muzzleloader. The pack out sucked, and the meat tasted like shit as a bonus. Literally put a bad taste in my mouth for muzzleloaders. A similar thing happened on the Meat Eater show on Netflicks but he never did recover the thing. I guess it just happens sometimes, but I've never seen it happen with any .308 or .30-06 based cartridge. Happy Thanksgiving!

Well, I guess I'm still in Roy's camp as I shoot a southpaw Mark V in .300. I need a flat trajectory and good retained enery downrange and it delivers...consistently. The shots can be long at times and I want the animal anchored. I am very-much after the "blue-spark" (because tablefare is the goal) and my silly old "Japanese" and wood-stocked Weatherby simply delivers. It does tend to "maim on one end and kill on the other" but I don't shoot it for pleasure nor do I need to shoot it often. The average is about 3-shots per year ( 2 at the range to confim sighting and 1 to kill). I handload for it and I know what it likes (earned knowledge, for-sure). I set it up about 25-years ago now, primarily for elk but it's quite efficient on deer too (it is a bit hard on the deer however, I prefer a .308 for them).

In Pennsylvania, I'd love to be using my flintlock longrifle, but out here you need to be competent shooting at distences unheard of where I grew up. Different horses for different courses.

Well....somebody did ask for pictures:











Had an elk tag as well, but never saw one. Public land hunting gets tougher each year. You simply can't get away from humanity anymore unless you can somehow restrict vehicle access, and even that's no guarantee. Got a consolation-prize doe and was glad for it. Back out again in December to assist another buddy with his elk tag (on a ranching for wildlife unit).

Here's irony for you...this guy lives in my side yard.

Great pictures Lloyd. Without significant scouting by someone, where does one set up with a sub two hundred yard rifle, lol? Safe and smooth for your December return. Gotta love those ruts that will be rock hard, and hidden with powder.

Cleaning up here today (almost as much work as getting ready to go). The evolution of ungulate hunting tools at this location (the '86 was my great-grandfather's)...



and something to help deal with the fallout...



My wife and I have really enjoyed some of the recipes within (some are quite non-traditional). The section on flanks, shanks & ribs is also unique in my experience.

I hadn’t realised that you were a southpaw as well Lloyd. Your great-grandfather’s ‘86 is sensibly ambidextrous. Is it a .33WCF?

Is the rifle on the left a Mauser 2000L (built for them by Heym) like my .308 pictured here with a 4-10x Pecar scope?

If I had Grandpa's 86, that would be the only hunting rifle I'd ever need or use.

Parabola: You guessed right, .33 WCF. Ammo has been a challenge since the 1970s so I eventually bought the dies and can now reload for it (even the special 250-grain flat-nosed "pills" for it as not common anymore, so I stocked-up years ago). It's a truly great old gun and I used it exclusively in Pennsylvania until I left there for good, back in the 80s. The rifle on the left is my Weatherby. Nice southpaw .308 btw!

BrentD: When my son finally takes possession, it will be going on four generations of use in my family now (it would be 5 generations except my paternal Grandfather had his own [& very-nice] saddle-ring carbine Winchester 94 in .32 Special, so he never used this one to my knowledge). Out here, I stalk deer with it in closer conditions (like in giant sage) and as you might suspect, it works flawlessly. The ballistics of the .33 WCF mimic the .35 Remington. I have killed elk with it (long story) and it would work great in dark timber, but it's mostly relegated to mule deer out here now (although I did kill a buffalo with it once...).

Lloyd,

Woodleigh used to make a 200 gr. flat nose for the .33WCF, so I asked a friend going to Australia if he could find some for me. He couldn’t but happened on a full box of the original Hornady Interlock flat points and brought them back for me.

I understand 210 gr Nosler .338 Partitions work well with the nose turned or filed down to produce a 200gr flat point.

Mostly I use 220 grain cast gas checks which can equal factory ballistics in this cartridge.

For cases I use .45-70 brass, annealed, necked down in a .40-65 die, annealed again and then formed in the factory Lee resizing die and trimmed.

My rifle is not a take-down, unlike yours. Thus far it has harvested one fallow doe, possibly the only deer shot in the UK with this calibre in the 21st century.

I am intrigued by the resemblance of your Weatherby to my Mauser/Heym. I wonder if they both used the same stock supplier, or whether Mauser just asked Heym to copy the Weatherby Californication style?

Parabola: I stand corrected, the Hornady's I'm using are indeed 200-grain (not 250). The Gart Brothers were clearing out their Sportscastle here in Denver many years ago and I stocked-up because they were dirt cheap. As you also mentioned, resizing .45-70 brass down to .33 WCF is a two-stage process that requires annealing in-between (to avoid splitting the case upon the first use). A very pleasant rifle to shoot (recoil is almost nothing) and very consistent. The later M71 (which replaced the 1886) in .348 would belt you hard every time.

My Great-grandfather Preston (known locally as "Pedro") was evidently quite the horse-trader when it came to guns, but he never turned-loose of this one. He bought it new in Franklin, Pennsylvania (at the very end of 1886 production) and kept it until his passing in the early 1950s. With it's shotgun stock and ivory-tipped front sight (& the Lyman running sight he later added) it's a very fast mounting & shooting rifle that both he (& later my father) used very successfully on whitetails in the big hardwood forests of Venango County.

This one's been used on moose in Canada (lent to a family friend in the late 1940s), elk, and even a canned-hunt buffalo here in Colorado, but a fallow deer (in the UK even!) is quite unique. There can't be many still in regular use.

As of this morning, a lot of quality brass in .45-70 and other calibers hit the shelves in a number of places. Even .348 Winchester. Brass is definitely improving in availability.

BrentD: Just saw your earlier post. No...I don't use trekking poles just yet. I suppose that day might be coming.

Dont wreck a knee or a back finding out that the day has arrived.... I don't always use them but they telescope and fit in my pack so I have them when I need them. I've had 3 knee scopes. I don't need another.