Every once in a while I see a poster looking for a Mod 21, Parker, Fox, etc with 32" barrels. Sporting clays shooters are moving to 32 " barrels on over unders. Is that waht is spurring interest in old duck and fox guns? Comments pls.

Sporting clays...Geo

IMHO, in addition to giving you a longer sight plane, the longer tube also helps you follow through with your swing. Longer barrels have always worked better for me. Maybe a new generation of young shooters is finding out what the old timers already knew. I guess I have graduated to "old timer".

On the collector side, maybe the lower number originally manufactured in that barrel length?

Kind regards,

Driven game shoots in US are springing up like shrooms after the rain?

Find if you can, a Parker or L.C. Smith 20 ga with 32" barrels and see what it sets you back, probably double over 26" barrels.
Those that have them, lucky. It's tough enough finding a 12 ga with 32" barrels.

I agree, it's tough enough finding 12 gauge 32 inchers. The longer sighting plane is what many shooters are looking for. You won't see too many NSCA tournaments won with 26 or 28" over/unders. Maybe that's because all the big dog over/under shooters are shooting 32 inchers. Maybe they shoot 32 inchers because shorter barrels don't work as well for the discipline. You can decide for yourself. Silvers

Some 32 inchers, top to bottom,
Parker VHE on 1-1/2 frame
Smith Specialty ejector
Fox Sterlingworth Trap
Fox CE with Monte Carlo stock

Lets see 28" x 2 ÷ 32 = 1.75. I sure wish I had a few of those 32" bbl'd monstrocities, I'd sell them & buy me twice as many 28" bbl'd ones & have 75% more bbl that better suited my purposes for the same money. Finest shooting gun I ever carried afield had 28" damascus tubes, both bbls ¼ choked.
Length of bbls don't change as often or as fast as ladies hemlines, but both move on a regular basis, "It's Known as Fashion".

I've got a 32" but like the 30" better.

32" guns are the latest fad. The longer sighting plane is a silly point. If you are looking right down the barrels, like you are supposed to be doing, you can not tell if the gun has 26", 28", 30" or 32" barrels. Your face is the rear point and the front bead is the front point and all the rib in the world should be just a very thin, flat space between the two. I do not look down a rib and see six inches of space at a angle. It is a very thin flat area so how long a barrels is not a big deal.

They, 32 barrels, are heavy barrels that are slow to get started but also very easy to keep swinging once you get them going. All the clay target games they are used in either are shot with a sustained lead or shooters do better with a gun that follows though naturally because of heavy barrels that smooth out their swing. The extra weight also help absorb the heavy recoil that the clay target games have with maybe a hundred shells shot in an hour.

Just as the 25" barrels were a marketing ploy years ago to sell more new guns this craze of 32" barrels is just another marketing ploy to sell guns. Face it no company made money unless they could either create demand or fill demand for new guns. All the big names are shooting these longer barrels so every average Joe wants one also. I


I remember years ago Remington gave a all American one of their 3200s and paid him to shoot if for the year. He did and sales went up for several years. That same shooter could have used any gun and did use another companies gun the next year. They made him a better offer, free gun, shells and a little cash. He now uses a 32" barrel and I understand he is looking at a 34" barrel for next year.

[quote=KY Jon]
They, 32 barrels, are heavy barrels that are slow to get started but also very easy to keep swinging once you get them going. /quote]

You must have never shot a Perazzi if you think all 32" barrels are heavy and slow to get started.

Or a 20-g Zoli Sport with 32-inchers.

I like them.

Silvers, nice collection of 32's. I especially like the "elsie" with the straight stock.

Sorry about the double.

My theory:

At one time there was a big concrete benifit in longer bbls due to the slow burn of black powder so everyone had them. When smokless powder came along it took several years for people to catch on that to burn all of the powder you only needed about 18". I still know people that think that longer bbls will shoot farther. So bbls got shorter because people really love short handy compact guns. I remember shooting skeet years ago when everyone was using 26" or 28 bbls. I think that 28 became the standard but there were plenty of 26"s. Sporting clays came along and since it was new, people were not persuaded by tradition to use the short bbls and since most people are much more likely to stop the swing rather than not being able to catch the bird the longer bbls became popular. I myself use a 32" for skeet.

This is a big benifit for those of you that like the shorter bbls ie. K-80 28"bbls are about 1/4 the price of a 32"

Stan, I have more Perazzis than I know what do do with. I have 12 gauge barrels as short as 27" and several with 32" barrels. Danial Perazzi himself once told me that he did not understand why American shooters wanted to "handicap themselves" with 32" barrels. Virtually all international bunker shooters (a very fast game indeed) shoot 29.5" barrels on thier Perazzis.
(Having said that, when my gamer was recently in the shop, I shot a 32" gun as well as I have ever shot my 29.5. But when the old one came back, it sure felt good.)

Best, Jake

Indeed. There are some bargains to be had. Also, all those old Superposed 26" (and even 28") skeet guns.
I think Dig wrote an article in DGJ about trends and prices. As I recall he talked about the great bargains in 16s a few years ago and also discussed barrel lengths and how the market has changed around them.
We humans are a trendy lot. Lots of herd mentality. I have always felt that 32" barrels were a bit cumbersome. But, they undoubtedly shoot well for lots of folks. It is the standard now days in sporting clays. I think it is the momentum of the barrels helping those inclined to stop or slow their swing.
I am glad certain guns are out of fashion. I love to buy nice guns at a bargain. I can't shoot em all at the same time but, for example, I shot a 26" .20 Sterly in S. Dakota this year. It shot great for me. And, it was a dream to carry.
Regards, Jake

There's nothing heavy and slow about a 32" barrel Parker. And if you've ever had the pleasure of swinging a smaller bore 32" Parker in 16ga or 20ga, you will soon notice it's anything but heavy and slow, the first words that come to mind are it's Pure Magic!

I have a feeling Mr. Murphy might be along soon to further extol the virtues and fluid nature of 32" pipes on a well balanced double. eightbore where are you?

O-D

All American guns with 32" barrels are much heavier than your P-gun. Yes you can get a lighter weight 32" gun if you look, but all the 21's, 3200's and with few exceptions all the American made 32" doubles are barrel heavy. Not a bad thing if you like a heavy barrel.

Skeet guns get even more barrel heavy when you put tubes in them to shoot small gauges. Makes it much easier to have a smooth swing if it takes a lot of effort to stop the gun. Light weight guns are easy to get moving but hard to swing smoothly, heavy ones are harder to start moving but easier to keep swinging once you get them going. Most clay target games are improved by follow through and heavy barrels give you tons of follow through.

"Game" guns are not 32" heavy barreled guns as a rule unless you count water fowl guns and pigeons guns. You will not see many 32" guns quail hunting, maybe a few dove hunting. Target guns, clay target guns, are almost always heavy by shooters choice. They like the smooth swing and the reduction in felt recoil because of the heavy gun. Most would do just as well if you made the same gun with a set of 30" heavy barrels. Clay target games, which were invented to mimic wild bird shots have evolved into very static games with little game shot relavence. Gone are the low gun, multiple styles of shooting. Todays clay target shooter groove their swing and heavy barrels help.

The longer sighting plane is just a myth. Stack the middle bead and front bead into a figure eight and tell me if it matters if they are 13", 14", 15", 16" or 18" apart. The sight pitcure is the same. NO rib between them, they are stacked. No difference due to the longer sighting plane.

Myths sell guns just like facts. Todays myth is longer is better. The 25" barrel myth sold thousands og guns for a certain British gun maker. The 28 gauge is the perfect or square load has sold thousands of 28's. Just like tighter bores shooting harder or longer barrels killing birds better at long range. Good sellers PR, which sells gun today is longer is better. Message to shooter buy another longer gun and you will do better just because it is longer.

I have started buying some of those 25 and 26" barreled guns that no one likes. They are dirt cheap. 20-30 years ago I bought 16 gauges because they were dead. Bought them for almost nothing. I still have several 16 Foxes that I paid less than $350.00 because they were dead. I bet in 30 years more than a few people will be shooting short barrels. Remember how many 30" and 32" double were bobbed because they were too long. What goes around comes around.

In a word, Digweed.

KY Jon, nothing wrong with short barrels if you think you shoot just as well with them. They certainly are cheaper, now. However:

Pigeons, flyers, which you mentioned, are as far from clay games as it gets. I submit that if the shooters who take the big money regularly could get on the bird more effectively, i.e. faster, with a shorter gun they would be using them. This is dead serious stuff, for big money. I shot in a flyer match with Cooley, Scotten and several of the other top flyer shooters recently and they all shoot long barreled guns. At least, all of them that I saw. And it can't be said that they just use the same guns they use for clays. Scotten doesn't even shoot clays, says he's afraid it would mess up his flyer shooting. Getting the first shot into the pigeon as fast as possible is always the name of the game, and if it could be done more effectively with a shorter gun somebody would have discovered that by now, especially when that kind of money is riding on every shot.

Stan

The truth is it's largely psychological and has nothing to do with shooting benefits. You won't find many women shooters who are caught up in this craze.

Let me tell you a story:

Once, a man was walking along the beach and he found a Genie's lamp. He rubbed it, and out popped the Genie who granted him one wish. The man thought a moment, then replied, "I want my (penile membrane) to get longer."

"Very well," replied the Genie. "Now let me get back to my nap".

With that, the man dropped the lamp back in the sand and ran home. He fell asleep, and when he awoke he found that his (PM) had grown by 3 inches. He went to work, and at 10AM he went to the bathroom and was surprised to see that it had grown another 4 inches. By lunchtime, it was a full 14 inches longer. By quitting time, he was scarcely able to walk for fear of tripping over his (PM).

As soon as he was able, he slung his (PM) over his shoulder and ran back to the beach. He found the lamp once again, rubbed it, and the Genie popped out. He demanded another wish.

"Oh, very well" said the Genie "Now what do you want?"

"What do you think I want?" said the man, "Longer Legs!"


Now do you know why everyone is after 32" barrels?

In a word - fashion.

Mike McIntosh, Gene Hill and Jack O'Connor all discuss the advantages of a longer barrel for certain shooting in their works.

O'Connor even discusses the virtues of a longer sight radius being beneficial to trap shooting.

But, I guess their works should be dismissed as "silly PR myth".

Kind regards,

To keep the flagging interest up in the off season.
The 32 inch gun, is much like the 25 inch gun...something different to be filed away in the cabinet.
My barrels picks would be, the 30" followed by the 28", and then perhaps the 32" for a matter of interest!
None have anything on the 30" gun.

Robert Churchill wrote with equal determination about short barrels.

Before that Greener, Burrard, Sharp, and many others wrote on barrel length, generally agreeing that something between 28" and 30" was generally best suited to most people for most shooting.

The length most favoured by each generation reflects the fashionable thinking of the time.

If a guy can shoot he can do it with any length of barrels between 24" and 34".

So many guns, so little time.....

I have been shooting 32" bbls. at sporting clays and skeet for three or four years, and shoot my Beretta 687 as well or better than any gun I've ever had. That said, it's not just because of the barrels, but a combination of that and other things such as gun fit, and simply having shot enough targets to improve my skills whatever gun I shoot.

That said, I do quite well in the field with my 28 ga. Parker VH with 28" bbls. and my 12 ga. Union Armera also with 28" (approx.) bbls..

I don't think barrel length is as important as some would have you believe. The heavier weight of the Beretta makes it swing better for me on targets, and the little Parker at 5-3/4 pounds is a delight to carry on a day long quail hunt.

Guess it boils down to shoot what works for you.

Ed

Danial Perazzi himself once told me that he did not understand why American shooters wanted to "handicap themselves" with 32" barrels.
Best, Jake [/quote]

.........Mr. Perazzi is about 5'2" and weighs about 120 lbs.

Interest in long barrels has zero to do with modern day people hoping to get more velocity or a harder shooting gun like in the black powder days. Gimme a break. If I hear that again I'm going to puke. That weary explanation is perpetuated by guys who read it somewhere & use it ad infinitum to rationalize their short barreled guns. As much as I like Jack O'Connor I could never buy into his admiration of short barreled 21's. But then again he never claimed to be anything but a dedicated hunter type. Another puke point is complaints on how sporting clays has evolved into tougher targets & said targets are no longer conducive to spray & pray chaps who can't or don't know how to use the front sight. Yes I said it, sight on a target. Believe it or not the best shooters do use the sight or end of the barrel to acquire & establish a lead. And that can be done better with a 32 inch barrel than with a 26 or 28.

The advocates that say short barrels are just as good as long barrels for all around shooting should go ahead and tell us their NSCA or NSSA class rating. Unless someone can put their theory in practise on a course its just an opinion & and you know the old saying about opinions and how everyone has one- same as a butthole. Oh yes, for the chap who was told that by Mr Perazzi, its Daniele not Danial.

Standard height and weight for US and European men has increased significantly since the golden age. Why shouldn't some of the gun dimensions stretch a bit too?

Quote "If a guy can shoot he can do it with any length of barrels between 24" and 34"."

Quote "Guess it boils down to shoot what works for you."

Couldn't agree more....IMO all else is conjecture.

So when lead is banned and only steel is affordable, when you bulge the chokes on your 32" you can cut it back.

Just getting ready, right Ted? I'm listening.

I shoot a 32" Renato Gamba in Sporting Clays because it follows
thru easier, I also like the longer sighting plane and it seems to be a more "steady" gun from station to station. I also have a 30" Renata Gamba which does fine particularly in closer transitioning targets.

I'll bet if a guy used only one gun for everything in 5 years he'd be pretty deadly with it on everything. It's all the switching around that gets a feller confused.

It was of course always a fallacy that BP "Required" long bbls. The pressure curve for BP is very similar to modern day "Progressive" powders so velocity accelerates at approximately the same rate. Using a very coarse granulation of course heavier charges could be effectively burned in longer bbls, but this was not the general rule. For all practical purposes a 28" bbl'd gun using BP is just as efficient as a 32" bbl'd one. Greener stated in the days when BP was still "King" that a ratio of 40:1 of bbl length to bore dia was suffecient ballistically. This gives a 29" length for 12ga.
For my uses & purposes (primarily upland game hunting) a 28" bbl'd gun has proved to be about "MY" ideal length. I could really care less if a longer bbl'd gun would give "ONE MORE" hit out of some 500/1,000 rounds fired on a clays range. Requirements for a "Dedicated" clays gun are about as different from a field gun as an "Indy" car is from one used to go pick up the groceries. I have no desire for a NSCA or NSSA class rating but that doesn't mean I don't use a shotgun for other purposes. I do not however base my gun upon one suitable for purposes for which I have no need. Neither do I take gun "Bird" (quail in my part of the South) hunting which is most eminatly suited for pass shooting geese. To not be able to choose a gun suitable for ones own purposes, but to strictly pick according to "Some Expert" in a totally different field is the "Heighth of Ignorance". Pass me the 28" please, it will do me great.

I like that, Miller, only I would say an "Indy" car is from a Model "D" John Deere. ;^)

I suggest matching the barrel length to the game, wild or clay, and not try to have a "one length fits all" gun.

GregSY is right. For the 11 years I shot nothing but my Remington Model 3200 tube set (28-inch), I was a far better shot then I am today, taking something different to the renge every week. So far this year I've shot Pheasants with a 1913-vintage A-Grade Ansley H. Fox 20-gauge with 28-inch barrels, a 1938-vintage Remington 16-gauge Sportsman with 26-inch barrels, my new RBL with 28-inch barrels and a Husqvarna Model 310ASE 16-gauge with 70-cm barrels.

However, the A.H. Fox Gun Co./Savage advertised 32-inch 20-gauge guns from beginning to end, and I want one in my lineup. One year at the winter Las Vegas show I found six Parker Bros. 32-inch 20-gauge doubles, a 32-inch Crown Grade L.C. Smith 20-gauge and a 32-inch Grade 4E NID 20-gauge. I have yet to find a piece of NID period paper that offers 20-gauges with anything longer then 30-inch barrels!