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EDM #204510 09/30/10 12:48 PM
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EDM, dont give up the ship yet, my uncle(53yrs and his first time at the vintagers) and myself (45 yrs 2nd time there) took it all in on Fri. we were not there to shoot just browsing... he has been looking for a 20 ga. Parker repro, and I'm always looking for big n heavy duck guns.

for us from southern NJ it was a easy 12 hr. day and we hit some favorite haunts in Easton too - Albrights, The Canvasback gallery and The Washington St Pub.

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I understand some of the feelings, but I can't for the life of me understand how a venue an hour from the nation's capital, and about 1/2 hour from the capitol of Maryland can honestly be described as "remote". For many of us it's substantially closer than Sandanona, and a really nice area (the heat was indeed awful though!).

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if all you men complaining after the fact about daily admission, would have done your homework, you would have signed up to shoot one of the events. &50.00 preregistration and you get free admission for every day. plus you actually get to shoot, not just write about your fantasy shooting here. also check the scores and you will see event numbers were generally up, not down. don't believe everything you read.

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I'm a Vintager member and shooter, so I've never had to pay the gate fee, but I think its crazy to charge visitors who want to learn about our sport $20 each - daily - just to check us out. That's no way to encourage new people to join us.

I know one person who brought a car full of guests this year to introduce them to the Vintagers who were pretty put off when they were charged $20 each. The same applies to people who want to check out the vendors.

That's no way to attract new people, and the Southern and Great Northeast SXS shoots don't do that. Neither did the Orvis Cup this year.

There were more main event shooters this year, and it was no coincidence that the main event fee was lower this year, which was a good move. More evidence the lowering the price helps increase attendence (and ultimately revenue). Now that needs to be applied to the gate and vendors as well. I have no problem with the Vintagers making more money, as a member, I like it, but I want them to do it by growing the organization and sport, not in a way that chases new people away.

... Also, I don't see Pintail Point's location as the problem. Each November over 10,000 people find their way next door to Easton, MD for the Easton Waterfowl Festival and gunshow. That's not the problem with attendance.

Last edited by DGM; 09/30/10 02:31 PM.

"When you have to shoot, Shoot! Don't talk." - Tuco

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZXlhSgq7us
DGM #204522 09/30/10 02:43 PM
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I can't speak for vendors and the price they pay for table space, but I don't think 20 bucks is unreasonable for what is offered to the public. Compare it to a movie ticket,concert ticket,dinner,or a few good micro brewed beers and price doesn't seem to bad. If newby is just getting into doubles ,I think the guns and prices he sees once in the tents will probably scare him alot more than the $20.00 entrance fee.
Just my thoughts, Dave

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The attendance looked alot thinner than last year. All you had to do was look at the parking lot to see that. There are several issues that need to be attended to for this event to continue in the future. The $20 gate fee is rather pricey if all you are coming for is to learn or visit the vendors. All it amounts to is a $20 fee to go to a gun show, which is rather high. It appeared as though the staff was either short handed or lacking this year as well. Each morning the trash cans in the tents were still overflowing, even after the opening times. This is something that should be taken care of well before the gates are opened. The food concession was lacking as well this year. Last year's set-up allowed for a much faster flow and had a much better selection.

Granted, these are all minute details, but when added up it can make for a less than desirable experience for a first time visitor. First impressions go a mighty long way. I am sure there were a few who attended for the first time thinking they were mugged for $20 to get in and see trash spilling out in the tents and nothing decent to eat. Not exactly the way to attract new and younger attendees.

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Originally Posted By: terc
I can't speak for vendors and the price they pay for table space, but I don't think 20 bucks is unreasonable for what is offered to the public. Compare it to a movie ticket,concert ticket,dinner,or a few good micro brewed beers and price doesn't seem to bad. If newby is just getting into doubles ,I think the guns and prices he sees once in the tents will probably scare him alot more than the $20.00 entrance fee.
Just my thoughts, Dave


I think that points to another major problem with the Vintage Cup these days.

There used to be a number of vendors who sold relatively affordable small items such as books, cartridge bags, gun cases, Orvis clothes and gear, sporting prints, collectibles, etc. Some were collectors, some made their own items, some were doing resale. They added a lot to the character of the event, and left many people happy that they found something unusual or even got a bargain.

I think there were only a couple of vendors selling primarily small, inexpensive items this year, and I can't imagine they made any money doing it.

No doubt, high vendor fees and low attendance have a lot to do with that. At the same time, if new people attending the event have only the opportunity to buy big ticket items such as guns, that makes it hard for them to participate as buyers as well.

I saw dealers of small items who were at both the Southern and Great Northeast (quite a ways from each other) who were not set up at the Vintage Cup. I think its safe to assume they were priced out of the event.


"When you have to shoot, Shoot! Don't talk." - Tuco

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZXlhSgq7us
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Originally Posted By: ZZ Flyer
I can't for the life of me understand how a venue an hour from the nation's capital, and about 1/2 hour from the capitol of Maryland can honestly be described as "remote".


OK, here's a test: Get out your map of the USA; find Pintail Point, and tell us how many double-gunners drove Westward to reach the location. Then estimate how many double-gun owners live in "Our Nations Capital"--sawed-off shotguns don't count.

It is a fact that the Vintage Cup is a private party for Vintagers; they get in free by being a member. I have gotten in free in past years when I was a member. If I had a table in the Parker tent (like I did in 2009), I would have been on the "exhibitor" list at the gate. It's not the twenty bucks---"true believers" will pay the price.

I make no suggestions as to how Ray P should run his private party for Vintagers and others so inclined, but I am thankful that such events exist.

I was at Addieville RI in 1997, and at Sandanona NY most years, and at Pintail Point the last three years. I was attending Sanford NC since before the Parker/LCS shootoff began. I have attended the Yooper (U.P. MI) regularly, and I hit Puglisi's Duluth MN shoot this year on the way north to fish the Boundary Waters. I was at Hidden Hollow PA last year, and attended the Vintager event at Northbrook IL. I seriously doubt that anyone has been at as many of these listed events as I have.

Would this well-traveled double-gun fan travel all the way to the Eastern Shore of MD if I did not have my kids living in Nokesville VA (30 miles west of our Nation's Capitol)?

Hell, NO!

As it was, Rt.66 was wide open and the Beltway moved along; Rt 50 to the bridge was relatively quick and no back-up coming or going. Ducked the bullet, so to speak. I don't shoot the main events, so I have no sense of what the actual competitors think. From my view as simply a gawker, the things to gawk at were diminished from prior years. Might be the economy...or it might be time to move on. Not my decision to make. EDM


EDM
EDM #204554 09/30/10 08:32 PM
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I just want to thank Dave W, a true gentleman. I left my "ears" in the shuttle after getting off at the last station in the red course. Dave took the time to track me down and return them, with no thought to his being inconvenienced, Thanks Dave!

The locale, and especially historic Kent Island, is one of the nicest locations in Maryland/Virginia. Still lots of farming going on, and beautiful water, fresh and salt.

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Hour and a half away BUT I loved Sandanona. The multi-day entry on one shooting registration is the bargain. My wife piggybacked free on mine every yr. at Sandanona and once at PPt. I think Ray P. has a right to charge to put his "private club" on display to the rabble, which of course includes me. Both Ray and the Mrs. have consistently been the essence of helpfulness to the casual (and casually-dressed)daytripper. Ray is AOK in my book and that is a bit more than I can say about many who have undergone the tweedy apotheosis.

jack

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