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Forums10
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Mar 29th, 2024
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,983
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,983 |
AMMO FOR VINTAGE SHOTGUNS
Available exclusively through Midway USA, Federal's newest Gold Medal load is completely safe to shoot in all types of vintage shotguns built to handle modern ammunition(??????????) The 2-3/4", 12 ga. shell contains a 7/8 oz.-payoad of 7-1/2 shot with a muzzle velocity of 1200 fps.................................
The above appeared in the latest Rifleman.
How were "vintage shotguns" built "to handle modern ammunition"???
They might be fine, but there was no mention of pressure.
Whadya think?
> Jim Legg <
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,189 Likes: 18
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,189 Likes: 18 |
I think I'd send an email to Federal and ask them what the pressure is.
The problem with ads is they are usually written by ad people. Ever see one of the cigarette ads with some Macho man holding a fishing rod with spinning reel on top side, i.e., upside down !? No telling how many tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars were spent to convince any real outdoor person that they were complete idiots, knowing nothing at all about fishing ..so much for 'Mr. Macho man'
Federal will likely give you the pressure, if you ask. Ad guys are just that. They are selling ads, and that is quite likely all. And just as likely the ads are being approved by someone else who in fact does not have many.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
From Midway USA http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=417403Federal Vintage Gold Medal Ammunition 12 Gauge 2-3/4" 7/8 oz #7-1/2 Shot Box of 25 (Not for Use in Semi-Autos)
This vintage ammunition was produced specifically for MidwayUSA to the following specifications:
7/8 oz shot, 1200 feet per second velocity, 5,000 pounds of chamber pressure
These specifications were designed to be kind and gentle to all older break-open shotguns that are safe to shoot with modern ammunition. This ammunition is also ideal for trap and skeet practice, or for use as a light game load - wherever a 20 gauge load would be acceptable. Perfect for lightweight game guns, for youth shooting or for anyone sensitive to recoil. Will not cycle most semi-auto actions. When you click Technical Specifications & Use the above is repeated with this addition: MidwayUSA does not claim or guarantee that this ammunition is safe to shoot in older guns, or any gun, for that matter, and we recommend that you have any older gun examined by a competent gunsmith or other authority before firing. This is the only gauge, length, loading that they carry. They are selling them by the box-$6.99 and flat-$64.99. Pete
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,677 Likes: 116
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,677 Likes: 116 |
What they are probably talking about is your Model 21, Parker, LC Smith type guns. I use the same loads in my Model 21 as I do in my Ljutic without batting an eye. 1 1/4 oz.- 17 gr of Titewad- around 1150 fps and about 10-10,500 PSI depending on which wad I use. Usually a figure 8. But a lot of your older guns like damascus can't take these high pressures..... The disclaimer is because they can't be responsible, even with their low pressures, that someone's damascus or a thin walled gun is going to hold up. The shells are made for a gun that needs to have low pressures, but they can't guarantee a gun that they have never seen or inspected. Even if they did, who's to say a barrel obstruction won't occur? It keeps them out of a lawsuit. At least, that is the way I take it.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,377 Likes: 105
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,377 Likes: 105 |
If that 5,000 psi is correct, those shells would be safe in just about anything that's safe to shoot, period. Would be interesting to have them pressure tested by someone like Tom Armbrust.
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,728 Likes: 50
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,728 Likes: 50 |
Sherman Bell's last two articles in DGJ were about shooting proof loads through Damascus barreled guns. He used 15 different guns, Remingtons, Parker, L.C. Smiths. His loads were Remington High Pressure 2 3/4" shells with 1 1/2 oz of #9 shot, wad is RP12 SAAMI loads. The velocities were taken with each gun and recorded, looks like it averaged a little over 1400 FPS and pressures were 18,000 psi. Each gun was held down in a Caldwell lead sled. Not one of the Damascus bareled guns received any damge to the barrels, one had the wood crack through the wrist.
He also stated that he does not approve of shooting modern high pressure shells through Damascus barreled guns, and that they should be checked out by a compatent gun smith.
Many articles and some great information on the 16 ga Reloaders Group on low pressure shells.
Most feel that on older guns with Damascus barrels and even steel barrels should have no more than 8,000 psi loads through them.
David
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11
Boxlock
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Boxlock
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11 |
I use the federal shells from Midway in my LC Smith with damascus barrels. Virtually no recoil and they work good on grouse. Less recoil then the winchester lite loads I was using. I worry about cracking a stock as I had that happen to a Savage Fox.
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 67
Member
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Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 67 |
Newby question:
I wonder why they are in 2 3/4 and not 2 1/2? Aren't you running a risk with the shorter chambered guns with this load?
Todd
Youth is stolen by Wisdom.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,155
Member
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Member
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,155 |
How do these loads compare with the Winchester Featherlite low-noise/low-recoil trap and skeet loads available at most ranges?
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,746 Likes: 743
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,746 Likes: 743 |
The Winchester featherlites are SLOW...about 900fps, and 5000psi, as I recall. Low enough pressure for most guns, OK at the clay birds, a little pokey for wild bird hunting.
A 2 3/4 length shell loaded at low pressure is a non-issue. The pressure is what you need to be concerned with, not the length.
Best,
Ted
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