doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com "Shot and Regulated by Holland and Holland"

Now what does that mean exactly? I have seen it engraved on the ribs of shotguns not made by H&H.
I'm looking at a reprint of H&Hs 1900 catalogue and you can have your Webley .455 MkIV 4" revolver shot and regulated as well as your Colt New Army Pattern also in .455, but they do not offer this service for the Colt Bisley Model in 455 or 450, I do not know whose .450 that is, might be the Mk 1 .450 offered for the Webley Green (WG) Army revolver. No semi auto pistols offered in this catalogue except the mighty Webley Fosbery "Automatic Revolver.
Mike

"After WW1, Holland & Holland sold guns bought from Webley & Scott as 'H&H Shot and Regulated'. They were taken to the H&H shooting grounds and were there shot and regulated before being sold with the seal of approval of Holland's. The guns were of plain finish and medium quality. The actions are engraved �H&H'. The top rib is engraved �Shot and Regulated by Holland & Holland'."

The above is taken from Sproting Shooter written by some chap named... Diggory Hadoke

I am sure that H&H and many others had been doing this for decades.

One difference is that some makers of higher end guns simply put their names on Brummie-made boxlocks from "the trade" and sold them. H&H, at least until the brief period during which they owned Webley & Scott, chose not to take that route.

Apparently they were doing it into the 1970s (nice little 16 ga, btw):

H&H Shot and Regulated

Here is an email from Holland & Holland regarding my shot and regulated by Holland and Holland 12 gauge.

"Dear Mr. Bates,

Thank you for your email.

We do provide a historical research service for a charge of �30.00 but having checked our records on your shotgun, the record is in fact blank and so would be unable to provide you with any further information.

However I can confirm that your gun was finished in 1967. Your shotgun was one of a number of Boxlock Ejector's that Holland & Holland commissioned to be built through the Birmingham gun trade as it was cheaper to produce and thus cheaper to retail. When the guns were nearing completion they were sent to the Holland & Holland factory for final test shooting, regulating and finishing. Therefore since they were not true Holland & Holland shotguns built entirely at the factory we engraved "H&H" on the sideplates and not the full "Holland & Holland" name and the model name; "Shot & Regulated" engraved on the barrels.

As mentioned these were made through the Birmingham gun trade with a large number, as you correctly pointed out, being made by Webley & Scott and coincidentally your gun was actually made at the Webley & Scott factory.

I hope this helps.

Best regards,

Andrew Ambrose
For Holland & Holland"

There is some question when it comes how close to finished the shotgun were when shipped for regulation.

But, how did they "shoot and regulate" these shotguns and how do you "regulate" a MKIV 455 Webley service revolver, that's
my question.
Mike

with most fixed sight revolver it is matter of tweaking the front sight for the load used.

All the ones made at the Webley factory between 1969 and 1977 went out as finished guns .

For years they were having the Holland & Holland name put on W.C. Scott guns. The late 1800s to early 1900s "Climax" and "Dominion" Holland & Holland guns were actually pretty low-end Scott guns.

It always blows my mind that a Dominion will sell at auction for $6000 and a Scott Excellentia (a far superior model often on the same receiver type) will sell for $4000 in identical condition. 10x the gun, 2/3 the price, same maker in actuality.

I had 3 Climax type guns, a C&H 12 bore, a H&H Climax 12 bore and another Cogswell and Harrison 28 bore, the last one I regret selling, as you can imagine.
All by Scott, it seems.