August
S M T W T F S
1 2 3 4 5 6 7
8 9 10 11 12 13 14
15 16 17 18 19 20 21
22 23 24 25 26 27 28
29 30 31
Who's Online Now
8 members (FlyChamps, Rocketman, Jtplumb, Replacement, SKB, 1 invisible), 205 guests, and 7 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums10
Topics35,925
Posts505,072
Members14,054
Most Online462
Aug 5th, 2016
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 3 of 3 1 2 3
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,503
Likes: 18
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,503
Likes: 18
Well Raimey, this is South Georgia; what else can I say. We know how to shoot!...Geo

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,379
Likes: 15
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,379
Likes: 15
Ah, there are some in Alabama that can shoot but many of the groups lack practice. Let me say that. Now guiding folks on hunting up the cripples; now that's another story. A 20 - 30 bird rise is an exciting event for man & dog.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,379
Likes: 15
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,379
Likes: 15
What really perplexes me about these choke threads is the mixing of constriction & choke, and tying neither to shotsize. For the most part, choke is 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 etc. Constriction is narrowing of a couple couple thou deviating from some nominal inside diameter. It really has nothing to do with choke unless you tie it to a shotsize and/or load. If we are going to talk about choke, let's see some percentages of specific number of shot in a 30 inch circle at some distance. It is as simple as that. Now if someone on an off chance has a tube with constriction that results in the same percent choke for #2s, #4/5 & 7 1/2s, I'd like to see it.

Another sidebar is even though the pattern may look lovely in 2D, it doesn't necessarily mean that all arrive at the same time.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 424
RCC Offline
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 424
Originally Posted By: ellenbr
I've seen a few groups only net say 1/3 of the total and then the number of cripples was near 1/3 of the remaining 2/3rds. Most of the cripples are fodder for the raptors and scavengers if you don't hunt them up immediately after the shoot.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse


That is sadly, indicative of the percent of cripples I have witnessed by those shooting at roosters flushing at 40/50 yards. I have yet to see near the number of long range shooters I read about on these boards and I have yet to see any of them drop a high percentage of those birds hit, Dead In the Air.

Thankful I am for good dogs that make the mistakes acceptable.

I will happily own up to being wrong if someone wants to "show" me, but after 58 seasons, the last 20 or so in the field 110 days or more, I remain a disbeliever.


bc
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 893
Likes: 3
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 893
Likes: 3
Originally Posted By: RCC
Originally Posted By: ellenbr
I've seen a few groups only net say 1/3 of the total and then the number of cripples was near 1/3 of the remaining 2/3rds. Most of the cripples are fodder for the raptors and scavengers if you don't hunt them up immediately after the shoot.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse




That is sadly, indicative of the percent of cripples I have witnessed by those shooting at roosters flushing at 40/50 yards. I have yet to see near the number of long range shooters I read about on these boards and I have yet to see any of them drop a high percentage of those birds hit, Dead In the Air.

Thankful I am for good dogs that make the mistakes acceptable.

I will happily own up to being wrong if someone wants to "show" me, but after 58 seasons, the last 20 or so in the field 110 days or more, I remain a disbeliever.


That's a really good point. Too much emphasis these days on long shooting and not enough on "hunting" skills.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,379
Likes: 15
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,379
Likes: 15
Well my attempt to bring in real data on choke also supports the inside of 50 yard attempt. If a rooster flushes at 50 yards going way, the fundament/raking shot is one of the worst shots one can take. At best, knowing pattern & feather draw on specific shot, he may fly 300 - 400 yards before falling dead out of the sky or he becomes a runner. And it is difficult to close on a downed bird at a 100 yards much less in excess of 100 yards. On our hunts, spotters are most important as if you have 3 spotters, you will find where the bird set down.

Now if the bird is coming down the line parallel(I've seen a few but it is most uncommon) at 50 yards and has been hit a time or two, that's a totally different situation. Gun dogs and good patterns are the key.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,418
Likes: 19
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,418
Likes: 19
You are correct Raimey.
Ass packing a pheasant at long range. while delivering a pure and succulent breast, creates a lot of runners.

A little humour, now.
I was run-off at NOBS for my far too graphic depiction of my work at a high volume tower shoot. I volunteered for the dog work. Where else can a dog get 500 pheasants shot near and around them in one glorious slaughter?

Anyway, a NOBS member of some importance said that if pheasant shooting in Britain was ever reduced to such a spectacle, he'd take his Grandfathers Purdey's to the nearest bridge, and through them off. I don't remember if he said that he would follow them.

Tower shoots always devolve to carnage. Every bird is shot multiple times. There is almost no sportsmanship involved. At the shoot I worked, we would see half the birds dead at the ring, another quarter walked up on the grounds around the ring, and the rest give or take maybe 10 out of 500, walked up on the grounds. A percentage were always too riddled for distribution, so some of the walked up birds were always frozen, so that each guest could take home the same number.

It's surprising how many guests have no interest in taking home birds, and leave immediately after the tower shoot, foregoing the walk-up. The walk-up is by far the more interesting part of the day. There were times when I walked up so many pheasants, my game bag split. 30-40-50 birds recovered in an afternoon. One benefit of it was that rounding up the escapees is a great way to instruct a kid in safe gun handling, walking in on a point, taking lollypop shots, and dispatching cripples. 20-50 repetitions is at least $500.00 worth of experience. Our birds typically were sold at $15.00 for the shoot, including a catered lunch.

On the one occasion I worked the tower, shot poured in on the tower as soon as a bird was witnessed clearing the transom. So, people were shooting at pheasants a minimum of 125 yards away. It was a tremendous act of faith to work inside a 12 foot square box with pellets bead blasting your surround.
We were told to never reach up over the rail. Just shove the bird up over the transom by quadrant as instructed. That way, excluding wind, each sector of the shoot has a similar chance of the bird gliding to their butt. We indexed two butts per 15 birds, making 2 laps of the ring. 33 butts, 15 birds/butt, you do the math.

As was pointed out to me, the guy that waits for his birds to glide in will see them exploded before him by the shooters off to each side, so, you better take them long or the other guy will.

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,836
Likes: 31
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,836
Likes: 31
I have worked too hard to teach my sons good shooting manners to take them to a tower shoot or for that matter a bad opening day dove shoot. We call the later zoo shoots here as you see all kinds of animals at the shoots. You know, monkeys, asses, pigs, hogs, morons of all types.

Back to the question of shot and chokes and the real point that needs to be mentioned is range. It took me years to teach range first to the boys. Know 30 yards in different types of conditions and you will consistently kill just about any type of bird with moderate loads and fairly open chokes. If you keep shots within 30 your shooting ability goes way up and cripples go way down. I made them count every crippled bird as a dead bird against their limits. It forced them to take better shots and mark every bird well. Cripples are almost always found if marked well and a good dog is around to recover the hunters mistakes. Besides it gives the boys a chance to see and appreciate good dog work. A good dog, that likes hunting cripples, is a joy to watch.

We take doubles with .005-.010 and .020-.025 chokes most of the time, sometimes .015 and .030. Adjust the pattern by changing loads or shot size. If long range shots are needed perhaps one of us will take a double with i/c and full chokes. Like most here I have tried to each my sons that your penis is not judged by your long range shooting nor is life only good with a full bag limit. Shoot, have fun and get outdoors with friends and family as much as you can. Life is too short and no good dog, friend, family member or farm will last forever.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,379
Likes: 15
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,379
Likes: 15
Yeah, those so termed Continental Shoots are a hoot. On one site, atop a hill, we stack up square bales inside a ring of rolled hay for the pit as you just would not believe where some folks would shoot. After one revolution you can pretty much tell where the shooters are and then in the pit we make friendly wagers on a bird running the "gauntlet" and making it outside the ring. Some groups will shoot say 60% or better and wound only about 10% of the total but still there are many birds, especially hens, that are just missed. And like you say CZ, few want any birds & I have on occasion loaded up 115 to 130 birds. Plucking is pretty much out of the question so build a large brush fire and get to work.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Page 3 of 3 1 2 3

Link Copied to Clipboard

doublegunshop.com home | Welcome | Sponsors & Advertisers | DoubleGun Rack | Doublegun Book Rack

Order or request info | Other Useful Information

Updated every minute of everyday!


Copyright (c) 1993 - 2021 doublegunshop.com. All rights reserved. doublegunshop.com - Bloomfield, NY 14469. USA These materials are provided by doublegunshop.com as a service to its customers and may be used for informational purposes only. doublegunshop.com assumes no responsibility for errors or omissions in these materials. THESE MATERIALS ARE PROVIDED "AS IS" WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANT-ABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OR NON-INFRINGEMENT. doublegunshop.com further does not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials. doublegunshop.com shall not be liable for any special, indirect, incidental, or consequential damages, including without limitation, lost revenues or lost profits, which may result from the use of these materials. doublegunshop.com may make changes to these materials, or to the products described therein, at any time without notice. doublegunshop.com makes no commitment to update the information contained herein. This is a public un-moderated forum participate at your own risk.

Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without prior written consent of the Copyright holder. For specifics on Copyright Law and restrictions refer to: http://www.copyright.gov/laws/ - doublegunshop.com will not monitor nor will they be held liable for copyright violations presented on the BBS which is an open and un-moderated public forum.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.0.33-0+deb9u9 Page Time: 0.035s Queries: 33 (0.014s) Memory: 0.8510 MB (Peak: 1.8991 MB) Data Comp: Off Server Time: 2021-08-03 20:46:15 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS