doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Shooting Damascus

I have reviewed most of the information on this site about damascus and it appears there are two schools of thought, "I shoot damascus" and "I don't shoot damascus." The more prudent among us appear inclined to relegate these old shotguns to wall hanger status. While I consider myself a prudent individual, nonetheless, I joined the "I shoot damascus" club last weekend when shot 75 rounds of factory low-pressure loads through my circa +1907 (patent date of 1907) Meriden hammer gun and I enjoyed it enough that I think I will likely continue to shoot it.

My shotgun appears to have the less desirable "twist" construction (photos below). It also appears to have some spots where one band was joined to another (second photo). Also, interestingly the barrel block appears to be of damascus construction too (third photo). I have read elsewhere that it was common to fake the damascus pattern on fluid steel barrels of that era as damascus was regarded as higher quality. I would like to see photos of a replicated damascus barrel should anyone care to share.

According to contemporaneous advertising, the barrels on my shotgun were made in Belgium. I think Parker likewise used Belgian produced damascus. Many opine that the Belgian damascus was not as strong as the English damascus; however, it is interesting that American manufacturers resorted to the Belgian produced barrels and did so well into the smokeless powder era. After these Belgian barrels were delivered, does anyone know just how much work (e.g., join, regulate, bore and finish) was typically done in the United States to mate them to the shotgun? My Meriden bears no indication of factory proofing. Does this mean it was not proofed, or simply that some American manufactures did not mark their guns with a proof?

So please, anyone who is so inclined please feel free to let me know I am not alone in shooting my old damascus barrel double gun and if you do shoot damascus, what type of barrel you are shooting, how often you shoot it, loads (factory or reloads) and how you use your damascus gun. If you are able please post some photos of your shotgun.

Thanks-

Doug

Doug, my advice please go out and buy a MEC reloader. They are simple to operate and from the chamber pressure tables provided by all the powder manufacturers you can pick a low pressure load or you can load black powder. That is after you have your barrels tested by a competant gunsmith that is versed in the ways of "twist" construction!!!
The nice thing about a double is you don't have to do an extensive re-sizing of the shell like you must with a pump or an auto-loader. The double's chambers size the shell for you. On re-loading presses there is a re-conditioning station and that's all you really need for your double.
All the best

Syracuse Arms 12 ga from early to mid 1890s; just a very few rounds thru it (maybe as many as five or six). Perhaps it is what I claim not to possess--namely a "collector" gun. Two Lefevers from turn of the 20th C.; one has maybe 125 rnds thru it, few squads of skeet; one 50 rnd. sporting course; the other I've shot exactly twice; high and low at station 2, broke em both, haven't shot it since. Only one of the three that didn't get the remote firing precaution initially; I must be getting cocky. All reloads fast smokeless behind 7/8 oz. producing approx. 5Kpsi. I find social opportunities to shoot these guns limited by the "looking askance" factor.

jack

I recently purchased a 1902 LC Smith Field grade with twist barrels with the intent mainly to shoot blackpowder loads in her. Lots of people go the low pressure smokeless route. The barrels rang like a church bell and the bores were mirror like. I thought I had that perfect vintage gun.

So she was mainly a secondary "fun" shooter. I planned on shooting a four of five boxes through her per year. I also have some 3 1/2 dram loads made up to see how she patterns with them.

However, I recently had the gun reblued and my 'smith discovered the right barrel was starting to give way, naturally where my fingers would be.

She looks wonderful in her new party clothes but I have chosen to retire her. A shame, I shot her very well and had planned on some blackpowder bismuth loads out in the dove field this fall. I am now looking for a replacement and looking towards steel barrels, maybe not so vintage 1920's or later. I'd like to stick with a classic name, Smith or Parker but maybe something newly made import, not sure on that thought. I even looked at Davide Perdersoli's 20 ga. breechloaders. Enjoy your Meridan! I still have a 10 ga. with lamanated steel barrels that will be sounding off on the trap range with blackpowder next weekend!

Two sets of LC barrels on e-bay right now
http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?from=R40&satitle=L.C.+Smith&category0=

My magic gun is a 16ga Parker hammer O frame twist barrels circa 1889 which I shoot with low-pressure 700X handloads and don't give it another thought. I consider myself prudent.

http://nitroproof.photosite.com/Album3/

About ten years ago I picked up a damascus 12ga. LC Smith circa 1894. I was banned from shooting it at my local club "damascus guns aren't safe", so I had it proofed in England in Nov.'98. Since then I've shot thousands of low pressure reloads at skeet and SC's. The gun was re-color cased and the barrels refinished.
While sending a gun to England for proofing isn't very practical having the proof certificate to show doubters is great.
I need to take some new photos for my photo site.
Craig

Craig-

Thanks for sharing the photos of your shotgun--she is a beaut! The damascus is pretty hard to miss on that one.

I shot my Meriden at a club and nobody said a thing and if I was getting dirty looks...they must have been behind my back. Several folks did go up to the rack and look at the shotgun, I think the hammers attracted more attention than my subtle damascus.

As for others' observations, I agree I should probably invest in a reloader and "roll my own" but for now I am using a known 5000psi 7/8s oz load. Being a humble Meriden, I am confident that the gun was not valuable enough to have ever been reblued, re-cased, or restored, so the gun's over all good cosmetic and near new (tight) mechanical condition gave me a comfort level in shooting it.

I suppose nobody proofs guns in the US, correct?

Here is what I mean about the condition of the Meriden:
Very clean bores-


Strong original case color

dbadcraig~
Thanks for the compliment on my Elsie. Actually the gun is a two barrel set... It's a very ealy "O" grade. The orginal barrels are 30" Stub Twist, the gun was fitted with a set of 28" Two Iron Damascus tubes and forend both marked "2". The stub twist barrels have a very nice original brown finish. I need to take a few more photos on post them on my site.
Your Meridian is a nice one... enjoy!
In answer to your question, no there are no proof houses in the U.S. Gun manufacturers proof their own new products.
The Birmingham Proof house has been around since 1813 http://www.gunproof.com/ It's the law in England to have used guns reproofed before selling.

This was my 'go to' gun for bird hunting for several years. I practice with 7/8 oz low pressure reloads and hunted her with 1 1/8 oz loads, both low pressure nitro and some blackpowder.

I wheeled and dealed and traded up for three years to own this gun. Lots of help given by folks on this BBS while in the acquisition phase. Eventually purchased from another member of this BBS.

She has accounted for grouse, pheasants and a few ducks. Sadly as I learned more about gunfit I found I don't shoot it as well as other guns I own. Due to some prior stock repairs I can't have it bent, but someday I think it will get a restock. My son has spoken for her so she won't be leaving the safe any time soon.