doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DIY Gunsmithing @ doublegunshop.com Rust

Hi Doug, thanks for your reply. I guess the fault with my idea or question lies within this part of your answer:

"... so by merely boiling some years later, no further color changes will take place after the oxide layers have been stabilized."

I was not considering whatever chemical change that may be occurring during the stabilizing or curing phase. But I do know that the oxide is not so strongly adhering to the barrels for a while immediately after finishing. In fact, I've noticed that some products like WD-40, which is supposedly not a penetrating type oil, will remove a portion of the fresh browning or bluing if used too soon after a refinish. But a year later, the same WD-40 can be used with 0000 steel wool to remove a rust speck, and with light rubbing, it won't hurt the bluing at all.

Now I'm curious what actually is going on chemically. The plot thickens.

Hi Keith....

I think what you are talking about is the "oxide layer" that develops on any blue or browned gun, hot tank bluing salts or rust blue, whatever.

You can wax a revolver or any other blued gun that is pre WWII or any age for that matter and you will wax off a "black oxide" layer that has formed. This "does not mean you are removing the bluing/blacking" but only removing the oxide layer that has outgased and formed on the surface.

Rubbing very hard with WD-40 on a newly blued or browned gun may remove part of the finish.....more than just the oxide layer....the bluing/browning formula's I use "cannot" be rubbed off, no matter how hard you try.....unless you use abrasives intentionally and rub very hard, like Brasso etc. You would have to be "a couple of bricks short of a full load" to do that though..........

Try a very old gun from the 20's or 30's and wax it with pure carnuba wax, like McGuires and you will see the oxide layer of which I speak, on your cloth, without damaging the finish.

Best,

Interesting points about salt in rusting solutions as well as neutralization methods. One of the uses for salt is when using Copper Sulphate as an etchant. The addition of an equal amount of salt to the solution (modified Bordeaux etch) prevents as much metal from being removed and makes the copper "felt" easier to remove, especially in less-than saturated strengths, say one-half ounce of each per gallon of water. That's the same strength as CuSO4 added to the logwood boil as per the Parker Process. In the P process it creates a fairly strong result, knocking the color back quite a bit, but really bringing out the contrast. I use it only for the first logwood boil, eliminating it for the second boil after two or three additional light rustings. If contrast is lacking, I'll use a quick dip in 3% Ferric Chloride.

For neutralization, besides the soak in cold caustic soda, in addition you can paint the tubes with a slurry of pickling lime and allow it to dry. After that a long soak in used motor oil (all the silicone has been burned out of it) and kerosine (50/50) really toughens up the finish.

II know Cor-Ten- bridge and structural work- best welding technique is Stick rod- 7018 Lo-Hydrogen rod- DC reverse polarity- uphill only-downhill- Nicht Sehr Gut!!!