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I doubt I'd be hitting much of anything past 70 yards. The old Winchester Super Pigeon loads, 3 1/4 DE, 1 1/4 oz 7 1/2's, would probably be my choice--assuming they don't limit you to 1 1/8 oz or something like that. I used to hunt pheasants with a guy who was very good at trap, and shot dozens of roosters every year with that Super Pigeon 7 1/2 load. He'd apparently never tried them in 6's until I gave him a box. He liked those even better. Unfortunately, hard to get that load in 6's in a quality factory load, although it's one you can easily duplicate
if you reload.

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I know shooting a stationary bird is not a good test of gun capability, because the "spin" assists in the break. However, However, an eighty yard bird, by the time you shoot it, has very little spin. How about shooting stationary clay targets at 70, 80 and 90 yards to see what happens "out there"? If you set up a close quarter grid of maybe nine targets, how many of those targets do you think would even have shot in them? As Mike, Stan, and I know, shot string does not increase the number of shot in a long target over and above a paper target, it decreases the number of shot in a long target. How do we break those birds?

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I'm gonna be ready Saturday with several different loads up through 1 1/4 oz. They'll might even give you the shells so everybody is shooting the same thing, at a little deal like this. Doesn't matter to me, really.

I do have a couple boxes of 3 3/4 - 1 1/4 - 6s and 7 1/2s, come to think of it. grin

SRH


"With one foot in the grave ..........and one foot on the pedal, I was born a Rebel" T.P.
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I know some here are fans of #7, why no mention here?

Also, 6 1/2?

http://www.ballisticproducts.com/Nickel-Plated-Lead-Shot-5-11-lbs/productinfo/NP05/

Also, maybe a #5 steel load might be big enough in diameter to break a target with one hit more reliably? It might suffer from low pellet count but has the potential for a very dense center of the pattern?

Last edited by 775; 03/03/16 07:16 PM.



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When shooting the long bird--especially the really long bird, the savvy shotgunner that plays for the BIG BIG MONEY considers lag-time, wind drift and drop.



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No way with steel. Retained energy goes down quickly with a less dense pellet such as steel

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When shooting looping, crossing, dropping targets at 60-70 yards, very little luck is involved in hitting them. There's still enough pattern density that a skillfully placed shot will likely break the target. The combination of distance, changing line and speed require a high degree of skill and luck plays a minor role for the consistent shooter.

Anybody ever pattern a gun at 80 yds? As suggested, put a target for a bullseye on an 8-foot square backer and take a shot. Then you'll wonder how we could ever break a target over 70t yds. That pattern represents the absolute, ideal, best chance of breaking a vertical, full-face teal....the kind that used to be used for 80-100 yd long bird games. I'll wager that the novice who shoots 4 feet to either side of the bull stands as good a chance as the expert who centered it in the pattern....that's luck.

It takes skill to consistently break 8/10 tough targets. When the winning score is 3/10 I'm not convinced the best shooter present won.


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One thing to consider is A.C. Jones book which suggests a single 7 1/2 pellet is likely to break a clay at 75 yards based on pellet energy at that range. He shows clearly that spin is a major factor, and tests by Neil Winston after the book was publish show pretty clearly by slow speed videos that spin does not decrease substantially over the flight of the clay. As I remember Digweed shot English 7's (like 7 1/2 here) out to close to 100 yards then went to English 6's (about 6 1/2 here). Digweed shot twice at each clay, which increases the chance of a hit but at 100 yards or more but even 2 well centered patterns still need luck for a single pellet strike.

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Gold star to idahobob!!! Anyone interested in shotgun patterns MUST read Dr. Jones's book. It is by far the best work to date. It is especially good on what is required to actually break a clay, a subject with very little research to date. Jones shows that exactly where the pellet hits is very important to the break. One pellet hit is usually/frequently enough to cause a target to shed a visible chip. Next time you are shooting clays, pay attention to how many targets break into 2-3-4 pieces; pretty indicative of a one pellet break. If a pellet hits a clay with enough energy to start a fracture (clays are very strong, but brittle), the centrifugal force of the spin will cause the fracture to propagate sufficiently for the target break. Remember seeing a target obviously hit, but not broken, suddenly fly apart a noticeable time later? When you see this you can note that the fracture took a bit longer than normal to propagate.

DDA

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I know what you mean but, it's hard to see tiny chips at 80 yards, Don. It takes a true "break" to be scored a hit in a long bird shoot.

OTOH, I can walk a clays course with you and show you MANY targets that were hit with upwards of three pellets and never broke off a visible chip, and these at much, much less than 80 yards, when the centrifugal force (spin) was higher. Videos notwithstanding, I believe a clay's rotation slows from the time it leaves the arm to the time it is at 80 yards, maybe not what he calls significantly, but physics does not change to suit the "suitor".

SRH

Last edited by Stan; 03/04/16 07:07 AM.

"With one foot in the grave ..........and one foot on the pedal, I was born a Rebel" T.P.
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