doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com 12 gauge 2 1/2" data?

I have a Thomas Bland 12 gauge 2 1/2" on the way, buckets full of once fired Federal paper hulls and an overwhelming lack of data for 2 1/2" loads. I have the Ballistic Products and Precision reloading information but other than a few bismuth loads there is nothing for Federal papers. Can anyone recommend a loading manual or source for 2 1/2" data? I have a lot of Remington STS hulls as well but would like to use up these paper hulls.

Marty,

I have a 12 gauge Holland & Holland Hammer gun with steel barrels and 2 1/2 inch chambers that I reload for.

I use 2 1/2" RST plastic hulls and Claybuster CB6100-12 wads to load 0.5 and 0.72 ounce loads. Here's my canned response to such inquiries:

Here�s what I�ve been doing to load 12 gauge light loads in 2 1/2" RST straight walled hulls for light 1/2 and 3/4 ounce loads. Actual weights are 0.50 and 0.72 ounces from my tweaked MEC charge bar.

I use the neon green Clay Buster CB6100-12 wad intended for one ounce loads. I use a 0.125" thick card wad in the bottom of the shot cup for my 1/2 ounce load. Nothing needed in the bottom of the shot cup for my 3/4 ounce.

In both cases, the petals are a little (1/16") higher than the shot volume. I have trimmed off a little of each petal before loading but I'm thinking that it is not necessary??

I use once plus fired RST 2 1/2" hulls and they look fine when finished, nice 6 point crimps, not dished or crushed.

I use a MEC Sizemaster for my loading and for the crimp start and final crimp stations, all that I did was use a 1/4" thick wood spacer at those stations to raise the hull to the 2 3/4" height. (In the pictures below, note that I have my MEC Sizemaster sitting in a low walled box to contain those in evitable lead shot spills.)

My load data:
� ounce: RST 2 �� hulls; Winchester 209 primer; 14.2 grains of Alliant Extra Lite powder (MEC #26 bushing); CB6100-12 wad; 0.125� card wad in bottom and � ounce lead shot.
3/4 ounce: RST 2 �� hulls; Winchester 209 primer; 14.6 grains of IMR 700X powder (MEC #25 bushing); CB6100-12 wad; no card wad in bottom and 0.72 ounce lead shot.

Have shot both loads on the skeet and sporting clays field and they sound and feel great. Very satisfied.

I may send some test loads to Tom Armbrust but I don't think he does any testing in cold Illinois weather. I use basically the same recipe in loading standard 2 3/4� hulls and have had those tested by Tom Armbrust with the following results for � ounce loads with Win hulls, Win primers, 14 grains EL powder (MEC #26 powder bushing) average of 5100 psi at an average speed of 1367 fps. The � ounce loads are from published 700X recipes and are around 6500 psi and 1250 fps.

I get my card wads from Craig Smith of Circle Fly Wads in PA and they cost about 1.5 cents each including postage per 1000.

Hope this might help anyone looking to do the same.

Bill Jolliff


Me live again. That Alliant Extra Lite powder might be hard to find. Hopefully better now compared with last year. Let me know if you have any questions.

Jolly

Marty,

As you have noticed, my loads above use 2 1/2" RST plastic hulls.

For your 2 3/4" Federal papers and your Rem STS's, you will have to find a way to shorten your hulls. If you go to ShotgunWorld.com and their reloading forum, you'll find ways to do that.

Hope this helps.

Jolly

Bill,

Thanks. I've been shortening hulls for 10 gauge 2 7/8 and 16 gauge for several years. This is the first short 12 for me. I haven't had much luck with RST. I've never been able to reach them by email or phone nor had them reply to my phone or email messages.

I've got about 12 pounds of 700X but haven't seen any Alliant Extra Lite in quite some time. I'll keep my eye out for some RST hulls but don't know if they ever find there way up here to Alaska.

Marty

Look around and find a can of PB. I know it is not made anymore but there is some still out there. I Just bought 32 pounds, four eight pound kegs, to keep me loading for life low pressure one ounce loads.

If you adjust the shell length slightly you can load 2 3/4" loads in to a 2 5/8" to 2 1/2" empty. Find a low pressure load and try it in a hull. I have had several which fit fairly nicely. When in doubt load up six to have them pressure tested. Several places do this for a reasonable fee. Then you have complete peace of mind that your loads are safe.

Jon,

You can bet I'd buy every pound of PB I could find but haven't seen any for several years. I've done exactly as you suggest but with 16 gauge and was planning on the same with this gun if I couldn't find any data.

One of the challenges on sending ammo out for testing is shipping it out of Alaska. Fed Ex will ship ammo from some locations but most of their own people don't know their own rules. I might have to load up several batches to test and take them with me this fall when I visit family and ship them at that time. Alaska's great but does offer some challenges with shipping sometimes. What do they charge for a ballpark figure for testing?

Might be worth as look at this U.K. site http://www.claygame.co.uk/ as they produce data sheets for all sorts. Data sheets don't cost much postage wise and lots of U.S. reloading components find their way here. You should be able to work something out from the mass of available data. I've lots of data for Alliant/Hercules powders; it's just that the wads might not be available. One load that might be a starting point is a Red Dot load suitable for 2" chambered guns as tested at the Birmingham Proof House. Any parallel tube case plastic or paper 19.5 grains Red Dot Win 209 or CCI 109/209 primer card and felt wads and 7/8th. ounce shot. Just adjust the wad column for the 2 1/2" case and you have a nice 7/8th. oz. load with very low pressure. As I say, if you can't find what you want on the above website just e-mail them and they may be able to make suggestions. Advantage being that all the worked out loads are Proof House tested. Lagopus.....

Thank you sir. I will check it out.

Yes there are 2 places that are reasonable.

Attention: Tom Armbrust
Ballistic Research
1108 W. May Ave,
McHenry, IL 60050-8918
Phone 815.385.0037

email: barbmiller49@yahoo.com

_______________________________________________________________


Precision Reloading LLC
Technical Support: 605-996-9984

info@precisionreloading.com

The cost is $40 per 5 shot string OR $25 per
5 shot string if 2 or more shot strings
are tested.

I'd email them to make sure everything is current in mailing address and verify that fees a still the same. With Precision you get a break with the second string but I often just do the one unless it is a new load or something that is not somewhat like anything else I have loaded before. Still ten bucks for the second string is reasonable to me.

Some of these generic wads tend to be a little variable in size and quality so the extra string gives you extra redundancy and will eliminate one odd result from skewing things. I had one shell that was ten percent or more off from the rest, cocked wad, weaker primer, slightly lighter powder load, whatever the cause. But the other nine were all exactly the same so one bad load did not make me thing the load was not a good one. Had it been one out of four that might have concerned me more.

I load 2 1/2 quite often. Don't be afraid to sub different wads of the same manufacture to get a load to fit. The shorter cushion height of a 1 1/8 wad will still work for a 1oz load and get it in a 2 1/2" shell and pressures won't change all that much. So long as you're not loading at max pressures there's nothing to worry about.