doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Buying an Ideal

There are a number of Ideals for sale stateside currently, and I just thought I'd offer an observation or two if you find yourself in the market. Parts are readily available from the French auction site NaturaBuy, as some of you already know. What may be less known is something sadly endemic to Ideals, even those still in France. It is damage to the inletting near the base of the top strap "swell" or "bulb". It occurs when the gun is disassembled (or more correctly, almost disassembled) by someone unfamiliar with Ideal disassembly. The two top tang screws should be slightly loosened, but not removed: the lower/bottom screws are removed, trigger plate action removed, then the top tang screws removed. If you see this damage to the fragile top tang inletting on an Ideal, it has been taken apart, or the attempt made, by someone unfamiliar with them:


FWIW

Mike

Thanks for the tip. The Ideal is an itch I will someday scratch. MKII

Good tip. Thanks for sharing that. I was just told the story of an excellent English gunsmith who went to the trouble to fabricate a new main spring pin for a Darne that was in for a strip and lube. The pin appeared to be "bent".

The pin is supposed to be bent.


Best,
Ted

To paraphrase the idiot Nanny State...."if it saves just one Ideal....."

Written instructions from Manufrance:


Manufrance Ideal Disassembly Instructions


Manufrance Ideal Shotgun Disassembly and Care

The Ideal�s action is of such simplicity that she does not require, so to speak, neither cleaning nor internal lubrication. We recommend expressly not to put oil into the action, through the holes of the firing pins, the sides of the triggers or the under lever, etc. as if this is not a good oil, which is the case nine out of ten times, it will seize the action and prevent the parts of the mechanism moving to the point of sometimes not allowing the firing pins to operate.

The careful hunter will, on returning from the hunt, clean and oil the barrels on the outside and internally, doing it sparingly also to all external metallic parts. If this is done the Ideal will last several generations of hunters.

Many owners of Ideals are curious of its innards, we shall indicate the proper way to take it apart.

Each Ideal is delivered with its own kit that includes a hollow screwdriver handle A (figure to the left) that holds three tools B. C. D, used for the disassembly.

1.- Remove the forend and barrels;


2.- (Fig. 1) With screwdriver C loosen the two screws on top of the action with great care, but once loose, leave them in place;


3.- (Fig. 2) With the other side of screwdriver C, after removing the small retaining screw, loosen and remove the screw that holds the trigger guard to the action;


4.- (Fig. 3) Insert tool D so as to block the under-lug in open position, allowing the under lever to remain depressed fully. Hold the trigger guard and remove carefully as shown in fig. 3 (To easily remove it, the screws on top of the action must be loose but in place);


5.- (Fig. 4) Remove tool D, remove the screws from the top of the action, and separate the action from the stock proceeding as indicated on the drawing.

For reassembly invert the procedure.

To all hunters that want to take their Ideal apart we strongly recommend not to force any part, as if there is any difficulty in the disassembly process it is because instructions have not been followed properly; in that case re-read them attentively and follow them exactly. Apart from this complete disassembly we can also, without removing the action from the stock, disassemble separately;

1.- The Loading Indicators.- For this use tool B, as shown in fig. 5;

2.- Firing pin springs.- Proceed as for the Indicators but using the other end of tool B, in other words insert the tool into the holes at the end of the action (fig. 6) and unscrew the long screw which is taken out together with the (washer?) and the spring.- After cleaning the latter with light oil if necessary, re assemble in the same way.

More guns are victims of screwdriver assaults than any other cause. Put them down and walk away slowly for the sake of the gun. And any owner who want to take any gun apart just to see how it works should not be allowed to even try it.

I got a 20 ga Ideal for little money because the stock had been broken during attempts to disassemble the gun. The opening/cocking lever was also bent because they tried to remove the triggerplate without depressing the lever.

The owner had even taken the gun to a "gunsmith" who gave up and told him to hang it on a wall.

I straightened the lever, glued up the stock and had it duplicated. It's now back in action. Very light with a straight stock and cyl/mod chokes.

Our man in Chile, JayCee, posted this scan from the original instructions. Each Ideal came with a tool kit. Of note is the last tool depicted in the scan. It is designed to hold the lever depressed to facilitate stock removal. If someone can dig up the original post and post the link, it would be preserved in this thread. I'll try to dig it up myself. Gil

Here's the link:
http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=168940&page=2

PS: Here's a tip that avoids using forum's search "feature" which has limited usefulness in my hands. Go to google, type in a few words that are pertinent to the search and add doublegunshop

Wonderful blend of style, quality and handling that hasn't been appreciated by many. While more expensive then they used to be there is still room for increase in value so now is not bad time to buy.

Would love to see a pic.

Mike