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ed,

Take your off topic questions to the private message feature, or start another thread, please.

SRH


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In regards to strength . . . I recall an analogy offered that I either read or heard many years ago . . . A 175 lb. mountain climber has two ropes that he uses when scaling a vertical rock wall, one rope is rated to support 1000 lbs. of weight, the other rope is designed to support 2000 lbs of weight. Which rope for the climber's needs is safer? Answer: They are both safe, as both will easily support his weight. Next question: Which rope is stronger? The answer is obvious, the 2000 lb. rated rope is stronger.

You could use the above analogy when comparing the strengths of a gun with or without through lumps.





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I don't see how through lumps are one whit weaker than non-through lumps where a floor plate is employed. The through lumps would make for slightly better reliability as well.


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We are talking about the front lump I gather. Because the rear lump is always machined through, its concealment being the triggre plate, at least that is how it has been in the all the SXSs I have come across.

Solid pin boxlocks are by definition machined through, and the coverage of the front lump is via the bottom action plate. Some of the very best boxlocks are made this way, including some double rifles.

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Originally Posted By: Researcher




Magnum Frame --


Let's take a look at these two pics . . .
Picture a testing lab with a machine to test the strength and rigidity of these two frames without the barrels or butt stock mounted. One end of the machine clamps onto the knuckle at the front end of the action from the water table down to the bottom of the action, the other end of the machine clamps onto the both sides of the action at the rear. The machine then twists the frame. Assuming both frames utilize the same exact makeup and tensile strength, which frame, in your opinion, will offer the most rigidity, strength and resistence to bending, the top frame without the through lump or the bottom frame with the through lump?


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I know I prefer the through lump for my guns. I have had the same problem with guns without it as mentioned earlier with a small amount of debris preventing the closing of the action. And it’s much easier for me to thoroughly clean the pin/ hook area when the gun has a through lump. Action strength is a non issue with me.


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WS, Is twisting really relevant to a shotgun?


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In horology, blind lumps would be called a "complication" for all the same reasons.
I don't discount salesman's rhetoric in their promotion.

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I've never heard of a gunmaker checking to see if the front lump and inside floor have an exceptionally tight fit - or of anyone caring about it.

Perhaps they did/do, but it sounds odd.

Not having a through-lump should make the bbls easier to fit and require less time overall.

When you put the bbls back on face, there's less work to be done, too. And there's no ugly gap on the through lump like you see here:

https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-f...un_id=101130969

The strength argument is odd, too.

Scott used through-lumps on their sidelocks from the 1870s to at least the 1930s.

I've seen them on old, rising-bite .450NE & .470NE Rigby sidelock DRs & 12g shotguns, too. I'm pretty sure Rigby is using them today on their new rising-bite shotguns and DRs.

So if through-lumps weaken actions, why?

I suspect through lumps were more of a PITA overall. I bet makers got rid of them because of the extra work they required and to tidy up/modernize the look of their guns.

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"I suspect through lumps were more of a PITA overall. I bet makers got rid of them because of the extra work they required and to tidy up/modernize the look of their guns."


That's interesting, as most guns with through lumps are considered cheap. I had always thought the same as you, a little more time and skill to get it right.

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