doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Super-X Pressures and the Super Fox

This question came up on the Fox Collectors Forum, and just yesterday I came across Col. Askin's discussion of his Super Fox and Super-X ballistic data
http://forum.foxcollectors.com/viewtopic.php?t=11016&sid=442e2a089e5bacce28260e7610286714

Progressive Burning DuPont Improved Military Rifle (I.M.R.) Powders were introduced in 1914. DuPont No. 93 was developed for the 1922 introduction of Western Cartridge Co.’s 12g 2 3/4” 1 1/4 oz. 3 3/4 Dram Eq. ‘Super-X Field’, and later was named DuPont Oval

Capt. Charles Askins and E.M. Sweeley “Ballistics of the Shotgun”, April, 1922 Outdoor Life, “Late Developments in Guns and Ammunition”
https://archive.org/details/sim_outdoor-life_1922-04_49_4/page/234/mode/2up

Outdoor Life July 1923 “Progressive Powders in the 20 Bore”
https://archive.org/details/sim_outdoor-life_1923-07_52_1/page/52/mode/2up
DuPont No. 93 Progressive Burning Powder in the 20g Super-X 1 oz. load with No. 7 1/2 shot 9,184 psi; No. 8 shot = 9856 psi + 10-14% for piezo transducer numbers

November, 1924 “DuPont Magazine”
“Experiments and tests made with Dupont No. 93 Rifle Powder in shotgun shells resulted in the perfection of DuPont Oval…” in 1921

The Peters Cartridge Co. ‘High Velocity’, United States Cartridge Co. ‘Ajax Heavies Long-Range’, Remington Kleanbore ‘Nitro Express Extra Long Range’ (the boxes were marked “3 3/4 Drs. Equiv.”), and Winchester Super Speed (also marked 3 3/4 Dr. Eq.) loads soon followed.

Western’s 3 inch ‘Record’ with 1 3/8 oz. of shot was released in 1923; U.S. Cartridge Co. ‘Climax Heavies’ in 1927. Peters also introduced a 3 inch ‘High Velocity’ and eventually the ‘DeLuxe Target’ 3” with 1 3/8 oz. / 4 Dr. Eq. and 1 5/8 oz. / 4 1/4 Dr. Eq. to compete with the Winchester/Western 1 5/8 oz. 12 gauge 3” magnum introduced in 1935.

Western Cartridge Co. never marked the Super-X ‘Field’ or ‘Record’ boxes with “Dr. Eq.” stating only “Maximum Load”. It is presumed that 12g ‘Super-X Field’ 2 3/4” 1 1/4 oz. was 3 3/4 Drams Equiv. or 1330 fps, and the 3” 1 3/8 oz. ‘Record’ was 1295 fps.

Outdoor Life November 1923, “An American Super 12” - Askins on his Super Fox
https://archive.org/details/sim_outdoor-life_1923-11_52_5/page/356/mode/2up
Super-X 2 3/4” Field with 1 1/4 oz. and 40 grains DuPont No. 93 powder No. 4 shot = 8,871 psi + 10-14%
Record 3” with 1 3/8 oz. shot and 42 grains powder = 10,080 psi + 10-14%

Outdoor Life December 1923 “10 Bores and Progressive Powders”
https://archive.org/details/sim_outdoor-life_1923-12_52_6/page/442/mode/2up
Super-X "Field" 10g 2 7/8" DuPont No. 93
1 1/4 oz. (215 pellets No. 4) with 48 gr. = 6787 psi with max. 8,086 + 10-14%
1 5/8 oz. (230 pellets No. 4) with 48 gr. = 6,608 psi with max. 8,535 psi + 10 - 14%

In a 1927 Western Cartridge Co. flyer “Super-X The Long Range Load” by Capt. Chas. Askins the 12g “Duck Load” (not specified but presumed to be 1 1/4 oz. Super-X “Field”) is described as 3 1/2 dram (38.5 gr. DuPont Oval Powder = 11 gr. / Dr. Eq.); at 1400 fps (at the muzzle rather than 3 feet) and 1000 fps average over 40 yards, with a breech pressure of 3 3/4 tons or about 8,400 psi + 10-14%
3” Super-X “Record” with 1 3/8 oz. at MV 1400 fps with 4.25 tons = 9,520 psi + 10-14%
Super-X 10g 1 5/8 oz. “about 4 1/2 Drams” No. 2 shot Full choke 32” barrel, average velocity over 40 yds. 1030 fps; “up to 13,000 psi” by crushers = about 14,500 psi by modern transducers.
Super-X 3 1/2” 10 Gauge Magnum in Ithaca Gun Co. with bore .795” with 2 oz. shot; pressures “about 5 Tons” = 11,200 psi + 10-14%

From the 1928 edition of “Smokeless Shotgun Powders” by Wallace Coxe, ballistic engineer of the Burnside Laboratory of the E.I. du Pont de Nemours & Co.
“DuPont Oval can be loaded with 1 3/8 ounces of shot in a 12-gauge shotgun to develop the same velocity and pressure as obtained with a load of 3 1/2 drams of DuPont Bulk Smokeless Powder or 28 grains of Ballistite and 1 1/4 ounces of shot.
Coxe reported 3 1/2 Dram Eq. 1 1/4 oz. loads and 40 yard fps:
+ 10 – 14% higher
DuPont Bulk smokeless powder - 11,700 psi
Schultze Bulk smokeless powder - 11,800 psi
28 grains of Ballistite Dense smokeless powder - 12,600 psi
40 grains of DuPont Oval Progressive Burning powder - 9,400 psi

It appears that DuPont No. 93 became DuPont Oval by at least October 1924



Introduction in the November 1924 DuPont Magazine
(you'll need to cut & paste the link)
https://digital.hagley.org/1924_18_11?solr_nav%5Bid%5D=4f8725dc3d15a407f4ba&solr_nav%5Bpage%5D=0&solr_nav%5Boffset%5D=2#page/2/mode/2up


This Super Fox ad appeared in the October 1924 Outdoor Life, and does not attributing the pattern results to Capt. Askins
https://archive.org/details/sim_outdoor-life_1924-10_54_4/page/292/mode/2up

Great stuff by Askins. Thanks for finding and providing the link.

Very good "discussion" of duck/goose loads, guns and killing distances.

I find it very interesting of how high the pressures were of some loads. I believe LC Smith was still selling some SxSs with Damascus barrels from old stock. So much from all the uneducated experts about how dangerous Damascus is.