December
S M T W T F S
1 2 3
4 5 6 7 8 9 10
11 12 13 14 15 16 17
18 19 20 21 22 23 24
25 26 27 28 29 30 31
Who's Online Now
6 members (LetFly, SKB, PALUNC, arrieta2, 2 invisible), 112 guests, and 5 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums10
Topics37,000
Posts523,734
Members14,233
Most Online462
Aug 5th, 2016
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3
Drew Hause #618656 08/25/22 11:43 PM
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 10,951
Likes: 135
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 10,951
Likes: 135
I have several sideplate Lefever shotguns that are equipped with a small brass mid-bead. They look to be original. But I have never seen any reference to them in the factory catalogs. One of my Fox Sterlingworth guns has two ivory beads, which identifies it as a Sterlingworth deluxe.

Originally Posted by Drew Hause
Hibbard, Spencer, Bartlett & Co. catalog 1895

[Linked Image from photos.smugmug.com]

Old pictures and advertisements can sometimes be interesting. But the ad above is no more germane to the subject of mid-beads than this:

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

Note: I am not selling a Forehand revolver or advocating shooting dogs here. But it would have been handy to have when I delivered papers as a kid, and was bitten by dogs four times that drew blood. I used a Wham-O slingshot to fend off many other dog attacks So if you buy one as a result of this ad, please send $12.00 to Dave Weber...


A true sign of mental illness is any gun owner who would vote for an Anti-Gunner like Joe Biden.

AZMike #618657 08/25/22 11:51 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 40
Sidelock
Offline
Sidelock

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 40
Take mine off & blackout front bead.

liverwort #618658 08/26/22 05:32 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 12,282
Likes: 412
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 12,282
Likes: 412
Originally Posted by liverwort
Is the mid bead some assist if the butt stock doesn't fit properly?

Yes, and no. It's a two-edged sword. A mid-bead can be of some assistance to a shooter, whose gun doesn't fit exactly, by allowing him to get used to how he must adjust himself to get the gun to shoot to POA. However, it can also be a detriment in that, if the mid bead (or the front bead for that matter) causes him to look at it as he swings on the bird or target, he will certainly miss, and he will miss behind.

So again, it may be useful to a pre-mount shooter, or someone getting used to a new gun, but is useless for snap shooting, or low gun.

I will not go so far as to say that the front bead is useless, too. We are never to look AT the bead/barrel/muzzle during the shot process, but IMHO the front bead is a reference point that is in your field of vision and gives a bit more reference to the subconscious as to where the muzzle is. My reasoning for this belief is this: I have been amazed, for many years at sporting clays, at how much precision is necessary to kill a going away target with a shotgun. One would think that, with the pattern spread that a properly choked shotgun has at 25 yards, it would be good enough to just cover the bird with the muzzle(s). But, I have found that is not the case at all. I have missed targets where the trap is directly in front of, and below me, with my muzzle covering the bird, but not precisely centered, many times. So many in fact, that I now make myself take the shot slowly and make sure that front bead is directly on, or in line with, the target. I never look AT the bead, or barrel. My focus is hard on the target. But it pays me big dividends to take a second longer to be sure it's centered, whether bird or clay. There are those few individuals that can shoot from the hip nearly as well as the average shotgunner can from the shoulder. Obviously, the bead is useless to them, doing that. But, most of us mortals are not that person. I need all the help I can get!

Lastly, a nice double gun with the front bead missing is like a beautiful woman that smiles at you and you realize she's missing a front tooth. She can still function without it, but she's not all that she could be. It is not my intent to demean anyone but, if a shooter cannot shoot well without removing the front bead he/she needs some coaching in how to focus their vision on the target.


May God bless America and those who defend her.
AZMike #618659 08/26/22 06:13 AM
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 251
Likes: 37
AZMike Offline OP
Sidelock
**
OP Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 251
Likes: 37
I figure beads on a shotgun barrel is like the parking lot painted lines, use them if you want or just ignore them.....but don't look at them while you drive!

3 members like this: Stanton Hillis, mark, mc
AZMike #618661 08/26/22 07:05 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,881
Likes: 135
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,881
Likes: 135
This probably dates the introduction of at least the Lyman Ivory Front and Rear Sights to 1895, which is the date of the Hibbard, Spencer, Bartlett & Co. catalog listing
August 3, 1895 Sporting Life
https://digital.la84.org/digital/collection/p17103coll17/id/48503/rec/1

[Linked Image from photos.smugmug.com]

I haven't found an advertisement or catalog listing for another maker of ivory front and rear sights until Marble's c. 1930

[Linked Image from photos.smugmug.com]

I have a collection of advice for Live Bird and Inanimate Target shooters here, from 1893 to 1925
Several observe the importance of practice mounting and being sure to look straight down the rib, but no one mentions use of a center bead
https://docs.google.com/document/d/17__6nT2u4mP22we08yCBThQ_a-VtmOueW5CisK3c2To/edit

I suspect it became more popular with the transition from the Live Bird "ready" position to Inanimate Target pre-mounted position.

AZMike #618674 08/26/22 11:57 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,005
Likes: 64
Sidelock
*
Offline
Sidelock
*

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,005
Likes: 64
but doc drew, watt duz hit awl mean?

how big or how small should the bead be?

an where on the rib should it be located?

and which is best? ivory, brass, gold or silver?

or perhaps rare polished unicorn horn?

smile...

Last edited by ed good; 08/26/22 12:00 PM.

keep it simple and keep it safe...
AZMike #618714 08/28/22 06:29 AM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 930
Likes: 38
eeb Offline
Sidelock
*
Offline
Sidelock
*

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 930
Likes: 38
My 1894 Cashmore pigeon gun has an ivory mid-bead. I’ve wondered if it’s factory original, looks like it might be

AZMike #618716 08/28/22 07:02 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 316
Likes: 4
Sidelock
*
Offline
Sidelock
*

Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 316
Likes: 4
while I don't like to pay attention to them while shooting I really like the look of 2 ivory beads on a shotgun. it dresses up the barrels and I would never remove or paint them.

1 member likes this: Stanton Hillis
AZMike #618718 08/28/22 07:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,881
Likes: 135
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,881
Likes: 135
Maybe this will help William
Mike asked when the mid-bead was introduced
The catalog listing from 1895 shows the Lyman front and ivory beads in the lower L corner

A 1903 catalog listing. (Ignoring the fact that looking at the beads and the departing bird doesn't work)

[Linked Image from photos.smugmug.com]

I'm afraid that I can't make the connection between mid-beads and shooting dogs.
Please google "looseness of associations" and the relevant psychiatric disorders.

We've also got a thread going on Trapshooter.com BTW
https://www.trapshooters.com/threads/history-of-the-rear-rib-mid-bead.924695/#post-8988988
Francotte (imported by Von Lengerke & Detmold) and Greener Single Barrel Trap guns were introduced in the U.S. in 1895 and I suspect the ribs had mid-beads.

AZMike #618719 08/28/22 08:29 AM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,051
Likes: 62
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,051
Likes: 62
add another idea to the list

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Last edited by Daryl Hallquist; 08/28/22 08:30 AM.
1 member likes this: Drew Hause
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3

Link Copied to Clipboard

doublegunshop.com home | Welcome | Sponsors & Advertisers | DoubleGun Rack | Doublegun Book Rack

Order or request info | Other Useful Information

Updated every minute of everyday!


Copyright (c) 1993 - 2022 doublegunshop.com. All rights reserved. doublegunshop.com - Bloomfield, NY 14469. USA These materials are provided by doublegunshop.com as a service to its customers and may be used for informational purposes only. doublegunshop.com assumes no responsibility for errors or omissions in these materials. THESE MATERIALS ARE PROVIDED "AS IS" WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANT-ABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OR NON-INFRINGEMENT. doublegunshop.com further does not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials. doublegunshop.com shall not be liable for any special, indirect, incidental, or consequential damages, including without limitation, lost revenues or lost profits, which may result from the use of these materials. doublegunshop.com may make changes to these materials, or to the products described therein, at any time without notice. doublegunshop.com makes no commitment to update the information contained herein. This is a public un-moderated forum participate at your own risk.

Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without prior written consent of the Copyright holder. For specifics on Copyright Law and restrictions refer to: http://www.copyright.gov/laws/ - doublegunshop.com will not monitor nor will they be held liable for copyright violations presented on the BBS which is an open and un-moderated public forum.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.0.33-0+deb9u11+hw1 Page Time: 0.085s Queries: 38 (0.049s) Memory: 0.8595 MB (Peak: 1.8991 MB) Data Comp: Off Server Time: 2022-12-03 20:14:09 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS