doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com 20 ga Reilly with .410 insert?

How does this work? If you can do this with a 20 ga, would it work for barrels that theoretically need to be sleeved? (Interesting that the ad dates the gun accurately to 1876, obviously using the Reilly dating chart developed on p.57 of the Reilly line).

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/974529122

Never mind. A trip to the internet shows how common this is and how practical. Interesting - I'd never run across it before.

Savage Four tenner inserts

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fr...amp;_nkw=savage+four+tenner&_sacat=0

Mike

Beautiful 20 ga single barrel!

There was a similar Reilly .410 gun in Chesire Gun Room, but I think it was saled.

Gene,

The gun was originally London proofed, but has been Birmingham nitro proofed 1904 to 1921 (no date stamped viewers mark introduced 1921).

Depending on how it has been treated since in last 102 years it may or may not be fit for use with 2 1/2” nitro cartridges.

At least singles tend to have thicker barrel walls than doubles.

Webley and Parker-Hale both made similar.410 adapters, but not as long as this one which skeettx correctly identifies as a Savage Four Tenner.

Unless the 20 bore tube is very grossly pitted you would be unlikely to have any problems with putting any factory .410 cartridges through one of these adapters.

That is what I plan to do with my 12 bore Army and Navy hammer gun when I get round to putting it back together.

Thanks. I believe this gun was rebarreled by Arthur Turner, Ltd, 33-35 West Bar, Sheffield. The SN 17099 on the barrel is probably Turner's. (17099 seems a fairly late number for Turner; and this barrel is still Damascus; odd in a way). This explains the 1904-25 Brum proof marks on the barrel and the Reilly name on the action, Reilly SN from 1876 on the tang, and London proof marks on the action flats.

I don't plan to purchase it; There was a Reilly .410 double a few years ago I should have bought. But barrel inserts for all sorts of center-break guns are available for 12 gauge on up. I was just curious about the whole concept. Especially why, if this can be done so easily, it's not used on barrels which are too thin to shoot in the normal gauge. Why not a 16 gauge insert for a 12 gauge thin barrel? There obviously is more to this than I understand but it'll be fun to research.

Here are some snippets on Turner: I will say after my experience with researching Reilly, I won't believe any of this is gospel until some sort of definitive book turns up. There are SN'd Turner guns on the internet.

From IGC: Arthur Turner's guns were actually made for him in Birmingham. Some may have come from Webley & Scott but think most were made by other smaller Birmingham makers. You need be in no doubt that Turner's double barrelled guns were excellent quality, better than most guns available today, but the higher the original cost the better.

From a Guns America ad: Arthur Turner guns were made in England and the firm had a long and respected presence in the fine gun market. Arthur Turner apprenticed under a well-known gunmaker C.H. Malehem and eventually took over the business in 1910 and passed away in 1941. The business remained in family hands until 1985 when they ceased operations.

And from a Alexi Morozov's Russian site: In c. 1908 Arthur Turner took over the gunsmith’s shop of Charles Maleham at 5a West Bar Sheffield. He remained there until the business outgrew the space available and then moved a few yards to the corner of New Street. The business was there until the 1990s when the building was demolished, then moved to Infirmary Road where it remained until fairly recently. The name was sold on and Arthur Turner Gunmakers lives on but in reduced circumstances

The 410er tube pictured was their improved model.( Featherweight ). Steel chamber and aluminum barrel. I have savage 410er tubes in all gauges. 12, 16, and 20 ga.. Have used them frequently in various guns. Many years ago I had called Savage to speak to them about chamber pressures. I was told they are manufactured that the 410'er chamber will withstand normal chamber pressure alone. I only encountered 2 problems with them. (1) I could not get one that would insert more than halfway into a FOX SXS. (2) is shown in you above picture where the insert jumps the ejector/extractor. In actual use the insert sits too far into the chamber.
Doubt the action will close properly as the extractor will be blocked. If it does close primer hits maybe too light to detonate. If it does fire the 410er extractor was not activated.

Briley makes some short inserts. Work mighty fine