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Tim Carney #130577 01/14/09 05:08 AM
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Tim,
No, I am not the moonlight bushpig hunter- though I have hunted bushpigs. I am a keen hunter and smalltime collector of double rifles and shotguns. I am also left handed and that is how I got interested in doubles originally.
Regards,
Charls

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Could not get the .303 double to regulate a 215 gr bullet with any sensible charge of either IMR4350 or IMR4895. Used my chrono and started in the 1800 fps range and ended somewhat above 2100 fps. Fifty yard targets were 3-1/2 inches apart and a desultory effort at 100 yards produced a composite group of six inches or so. NOTE: barrels are 28 inches.

Sent the rifle and 60 cartridges made up of woodleigh 215 gr bullets, RP brass, CCI 200 primer and my chosen load of IMR4350 (somewhat more than manuals recommend) to JJ Perodeau at Champlins to regulate and to add a top lever peep site (see Clair Kofoed and Dave Webster thread below). JJ called me a few days ago, has done the regulation, added a Purdey-style peep, as opposed to the Geo. Hoenig depicted in the below thread, and is sending the rifle back for me to try and ensure a successful effort.

I'll post here and on accuratereloading.com with pictures if results merit.

Regards, Tim

Tim Carney #142416 03/31/09 01:37 PM
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Another source of 215 grain round nose bullets is Hawk Precision in Salem, NJ.

Story #142426 03/31/09 02:14 PM
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Tim how much did the regulation cost you? I buy a few double rifles and might need the service. Please post a photo of the peep. I'm going to need one with my eyes. Thanks

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Originally Posted By: Mike Harrell
Tim how much did the regulation cost you? I buy a few double rifles and might need the service. Please post a photo of the peep. I'm going to need one with my eyes. Thanks


Mike,

You regulate an old double rifle by experimentation with bullet weight and powder charge. Markings on the rifle or data from the manufacturers records (if they exist) are a starting point.

It's highly unlikely that modern ammo will match the ballistics of the ammunition used to regulate an old double rifle 50, 100 or even 125 years old.

There are perhaps a dozen men in the world who are skilled enough to take your rifle barrels, remove the ribs and re-regulate the barrels by the adjustments used during original manufacture. The cost would be astronomical as well, certainly you would be looking at a four figure sum, and not a small four figure sum at that.

Experimentation to try and duplicate the original ammunition can be fun, if somewhat frustrating. (Been there, done that, etc.

Harry


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Harry I know that. I owned a .577 that would not regulate no matter the load, bullet or any combination thereof. I ended up selling it. I would have liked to have had it reregulated if it wouldn't cost me too much.

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Originally Posted By: Harry Eales
Originally Posted By: Mike Harrell
Tim how much did the regulation cost you? I buy a few double rifles and might need the service. Please post a photo of the peep. I'm going to need one with my eyes. Thanks


Mike,

You regulate an old double rifle by experimentation with bullet weight and powder charge. Markings on the rifle or data from the manufacturers records (if they exist) are a starting point.

It's highly unlikely that modern ammo will match the ballistics of the ammunition used to regulate an old double rifle 50, 100 or even 125 years old.

There are perhaps a dozen men in the world who are skilled enough to take your rifle barrels, remove the ribs and re-regulate the barrels by the adjustments used during original manufacture. The cost would be astronomical as well, certainly you would be looking at a four figure sum, and not a small four figure sum at that.

Experimentation to try and duplicate the original ammunition can be fun, if somewhat frustrating. (Been there, done that, etc.

Harry


Not to be contrarian, but this just isn't true.

Sure, you start out with a load that duplicates the original, and that usually works. However, it's a fact of life that some double rifles get out of regulation over time.

Regulation, or re-regulation, is conducted with fully finished barrels. Indeed, any loose ribs must be stripped off and relaid before regulation can proceed. That's the only reason to remove a rib before re-regulation and is, of course, not the norm. The only difference between regulation at the factory and re-regulation later is that is that the former is done before the barrels are blacked, and the latter can require reblacking, but only if something goes wrong. I can't imagine why someone would think that ribs need to be removed in order to re-regulate a double rifle.

Re-regulation isn't a big deal. J. J. quotes $600 for re-regulation, and you supply the ammo. If he supplies it, he charges for it, of course. He warns that the need for re-blacking runs 50-50, but I think he's just being cautious there. Of the 6-8 he's done for me and friends of mine, none have required re-blacking and there's no cosmetic evidence of the work at all. All have shot great. I recommend J. J.'s re-regulation work highly.




"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."
Tim Carney #142467 03/31/09 06:48 PM
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Tim:

Have you shot the .303 yet?


"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."
Tim Carney #144188 04/14/09 11:11 PM
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I am curious how much it cost to have the gun shipped if it was shipped overseas.It look like one I was looking at at an aution site.Might have been Holts or Gardners.I have seen several shotguns I would like to have had but when I figure the 20 % pluss shipping I seems like it is getting exspensive.

Monty McGee
I post as jeweler my E is montgom@tecinfo.com


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Gents,

SEnt it to Champlins with 60 rounds of Woodleigh 215 gr .312 bullets and my load of IMR 4350. Got it back, shot it and found it is regulated but prints to high and (not a problem) too far right. JJ at Champlins has it now to make a slightly larger (60 thou) and higher foresight. He'll also tap the backsight so the POI moves to the left.

Here is a look at my last five shots, done with the peep at 100 yards:



Here's a pic of the Purdey-style top lever peep, somewhat flimsier than the Hoenig (?) style illustrated here on the board but it works: the front bead, small as it is, down in the vee was in focus!



Separate problem is that the primers on the right barrel are slightly backing out -- confused me at first as I thought the brass was grossly stretching. Possibly the bushing is somewhat loose. JJ is checking into it.

More when I get it back.

Sorry lads, seem to have forgotten how to post photos from photobucket Just click on the link you may have to enlarge the photos for best viewing.... Ah, that might have done it, forget the forward slash

Regards, Tim

Last edited by Tim Carney; 04/15/09 06:08 PM.
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