March
S M T W T F S
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31
Who's Online Now
6 members (Hammergun, Lloyd3, fallschirmjaeger, Argo44, 2 invisible), 813 guests, and 4 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums10
Topics38,374
Posts544,010
Members14,391
Most Online1,131
Jan 21st, 2024
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 194
Sidelock
**
OP Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 194
I have been offered this gun, 70% condition, for $700. After checking around it looks like a sleeve job will be around $1800. Will this be a $2500. gun when done? What to do? Any one have any ideas?

Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,567
Likes: 79
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,567
Likes: 79
No it will not be.

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,693
Likes: 450
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,693
Likes: 450
Far easier and cheaper to find a second set of barrels and have them fit to the gun. Still will end up with a mismatched serialnumbered gun that will be a nice shooter. Original condition is gone forever and nothing will bring that back. So start thinking in terms of making the gun into a nice shooter because that is all it can ever be from this point on.

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 13,879
Likes: 15
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 13,879
Likes: 15
Jerry,
I'm in agreement that the gun will not end up to be worth anywhere near $2500. However, if you can do the work yourself, it would be worthwhile. I can do this work and find this gun attractive for the price. Let me know if you would like to pass this deal along to me.

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,711
Likes: 730
Sidelock
**
Online Content
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,711
Likes: 730
I'm getting uncomfortable with the numbers of Fox guns passing through this site (and, others) in freshly "blown up" condition, frames and/or barrels. What the heck are folks doing with them? I had always thought that a Fox had a lot going for it, as long as one could get used to the idea it would end up striker bound at some point and need the services of a good 'smith. Folks seem to accept the idea their model 21s will likely pop a rib someday, or their Elsie will need it's stock attended to, and love those guns, so the concept isn't without precedent, but, I have grown fond of my fingers and eyes, middle aged as they are.

Tampered with bores and bore obstructions aside, is there something that is leading to the rash of broken Foxes? Just curious.
Best,
Ted

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 551
Sidelock
*
Offline
Sidelock
*

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 551
I have 2 fox shotguns, bought one from a guy that was shooting 3inch shell thru it..not every one has common sense...

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,693
Likes: 450
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,693
Likes: 450
Ted,

Figure that 95% of shot gun owners are sane, safe people who do not use or abuse their guns in a unsafe manner. That leaves 5% who do not. They are either stupid, poorly informed, unwilling to use what we consider common sense or reasonable precautions or just unlucky enough to have a gun fail because of ammo problems, bore obstructions or just age/fatigue of their guns. It is from this group most of the failures that we see come.

Seeing the results of a few of them does not suprise me. In fact I have to say that I suspect that many are just keep a secret as most people hate to admit that they screwed up and did anything that might be thought of as stupid.

I suspect that if Wally-Worlds' shells ran about 7,000 psi instead of 10-11,000, that most of the failures we see would go away. Modern shells, shot in gun not designed for them, with a 75 year accumulation of bad gunsmithing is a disaster waiting to happen.

Funny that you have not heard of any Ithaca NID or Winchester M-21 having problems. They are the only two real "modern" designed gun that many of us shoot. I would never drop a couple Wally World shells into one of my Lefevers. I, like you, have grown quite attached to my fingers. Plus it would be such a waste of a nice Lefever.

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,245
Likes: 4
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,245
Likes: 4
On the 21 "likely popping a rib some day". Is that fact or a wives tale? I have 4 of these guns, shoot them a lot with modern ammo, and haven't had a problem with a rib or anything else for that matter. Has anyone here on this site had a 21 with a popped rib? Silvers


I AM SILVERS, NOT SLIVER = two different members. I'm in the northeast, the other member is in MT.
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,711
Likes: 730
Sidelock
**
Online Content
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,711
Likes: 730
The 21s pop ribs on occasion for good reason-the steel the tubes are made from feature a goodly amount of chromium, and that makes the job of soldering ribs difficult, as the steel is difficult to wet.
It is not a wives tale, and was mentioned in a letter John Olin sent to a customer pertaining to the forend loop coming loose on his gun. Are all 21s going to pop a rib? Doubtful. Do 21s suffer popped ribs as often or more than other gun designs from the same era? Without question.
Best,
Ted

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 236
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 236
After all the years i worked on doubles i noticed most blown bbls happen around the halfway point, just ahead of the forearm where pressure should have dropped by 60%. Most bbls mike out an average of .030 of an inch inwall thickness. The bores on most of these older double bbles. are tighter than todays standard. The old paper case was much thicker than plastic therefore the projectile (for lack of a better discription) was smaller in dia.than a plastic case with a shot cup that is bigger in dia. Couple that with increased pressure and older work hardened steel its no wonder we see these things happening. This is just my oppinion. Its always supprising to people who see a bbl. blown out almost flat, they cant believe how wide it is . Almost as wide as there eyes when it happens. I think if i had a high grade older double i would only use the older style European shells. Rich


Page 1 of 2 1 2

Link Copied to Clipboard

doublegunshop.com home | Welcome | Sponsors & Advertisers | DoubleGun Rack | Doublegun Book Rack

Order or request info | Other Useful Information

Updated every minute of everyday!


Copyright (c) 1993 - 2024 doublegunshop.com. All rights reserved. doublegunshop.com - Bloomfield, NY 14469. USA These materials are provided by doublegunshop.com as a service to its customers and may be used for informational purposes only. doublegunshop.com assumes no responsibility for errors or omissions in these materials. THESE MATERIALS ARE PROVIDED "AS IS" WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANT-ABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OR NON-INFRINGEMENT. doublegunshop.com further does not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials. doublegunshop.com shall not be liable for any special, indirect, incidental, or consequential damages, including without limitation, lost revenues or lost profits, which may result from the use of these materials. doublegunshop.com may make changes to these materials, or to the products described therein, at any time without notice. doublegunshop.com makes no commitment to update the information contained herein. This is a public un-moderated forum participate at your own risk.

Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without prior written consent of the Copyright holder. For specifics on Copyright Law and restrictions refer to: http://www.copyright.gov/laws/ - doublegunshop.com will not monitor nor will they be held liable for copyright violations presented on the BBS which is an open and un-moderated public forum.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.0.33-0+deb9u11+hw1 Page Time: 0.078s Queries: 35 (0.056s) Memory: 0.8458 MB (Peak: 1.8987 MB) Data Comp: Off Server Time: 2024-03-29 00:57:21 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS