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Forums10
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Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Marc always comes thru with some interesting auction finds: http://www.stiegele-jagd.de/catalog/view/page/3/options_id/242  I've just glanced at the gold/copper? inlay on the left lock & frame and I'm curious exactly what it is.  Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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Joined: Apr 2005
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2005
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The gold/copper colored leaf seems to be a later addition, maybe to hide a defect.
The seller suggests this gun belonged to Kaiser Wilhelm but the crown over W is not closed shape Souvereign (Royal) type but of lower rank, seemingly 9-point open shape, indicating a Count.
With kind regards,
Jani
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Thanks Jani for the once over analysis and translation. At first guess I didn't think it was that of the Kaisers, but the following link seems to suggest that the Kaiser obtained weapons from W. Foerster for gifts. I'll have to look but I don't recall seeing any of the Kaiser's weapons with a crossover stock. http://www.nmm.ac.uk/collections/explore/object.cfm?ID=AAA2541 W. Foerster was a master gunsmith and a supplier to the Royal Court of Carl(1801-1883) von Preussen from 50 Tauben Strasse 50, Ecke Der Kanonier Strasse, or what I think to mean as also being at/near the corner of Cannon Street. Carl von Preussen was the 3rd son of King Friedrich William III of Prussian. Carl had 5 sisters one of them being Charlotte of Prussia, who had a very close relationship with Carl von Preussen demonstrated by her caring for Carl even after she was wed to Tsar Nicholas I of Russian. Carl von Preussen attended her coronation to the title of Tsarina Alexandra Feodorovna. Carl von Preussen visited Russian several times and this is the social network/connection that allowed W. Foerster to be a firearms merchant/supplier to kings and Tsars. Firearms merchants with a royal appointment or being interconnected to the court seems to really elevate the status of the maker/supplier in the eyes of many & the firearms merchant touts that thru advertising. W. Foerster seems to have had such a following in Russia. But W. Foerster hit the jackpot with his royal warrant/supplier to the Royal Court of Carl von Preussen as Carl took the military route for his ascension and by 1824 he had the rank of Major-General which was a stepping stone for head of artillery by the 1850s. Carl looks to have had a great interest in hunting and passed the passion by purchasing the Glienicke hunting lodge for his son Prince Friedrich Karl, which was yet another source for W. Foerster to supply. Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Philbert, I do and thanks for adding them to the thread. Your example passed thru the Suhl proofhouse between 1912 & 1923. I'm curious if W. Foerster had a client who wanted an additional set of tubes and then W. Foerster sourced J. Ansorg of Würzburg who in turn sourced a relative in Suhl?? Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2
Boxlock
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Boxlock
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2 |
hallo
i also have the shotgun marked W.Foerster berlin. it's strange... but i have doubts that it was made for Wilhelm.
my shotgun is double-barreled, its made with all the care and precision of a work of art. engraved with gold and silver. metal has a marble effect (texture) with rich ornaments and butt is made of chosen piece of walnut with exquisite structure. on the top it has a monogram (initials) with crown above and also golden number "2" in the circle.
About golden number "2" on the shotgun i have learned that, for the important persons, as a rule there was making the pair of identical shotguns - difference was only in diameter of barrels. first was 12-bore for the hunting on beasts and second was 16-bore for the birds.
My attention was especially laid on the monogram. During its identification I started to think that this shotgun was made for the German emperor Wilhelm the second. First of all - from the shape of the crown I verified that it is “margrave's” crown. On the other side I found that Hohenzollerns were the margraves of Brandenburg. Also on one of Russian internet sites I found an article where was told that Augusta Victoria (Wilhelm 2s firs wife) presented him with a pair of double-barreled shotguns made by the royal gunsmith W.Foerster. In “ Potsdam ” there is a museum of royal firearms and I can’t find there Augusta ’s gift to Wilhelm. My doubts aggravated the fact that the grandfather of the person from whom I bought this shotgun was the soviet “polkovnik” and after the world war 2 he was living in “ Potsdam ” for about 6 years.
Unfortunately, i dont understand how to put photos here. can someone told me how can i do this?
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,818 Likes: 194
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
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Nikoloz's pics:    Was the left hand of the Kaiser that had an issue? This longarm looks to be a left handed opener. The 24 scatterguns and 32 rifles which were the hunting weapons of the Kaiser are located in the Royal Palace in Berlin and also in Palais in Potsdam. An article in the 1913 Wild und Hund was translated by GGCA's Mr. Dietrich Apel and a portion of it is in Vol. 17 at page 8. It gives that Paton u. Walsh-London made a 16 bore Lefaucheux double, 2 16 bore doubles by H. Leue & F. Timpe of Berlin, 2 12 bore scatterguns by Lancaster of London with "Woodward" steel tubes, which I guess to be Whitworth? and an 1888 vintage pair of hammergun by W. Foerster of Berlin belonging to Kaiserin Auguste Victoria are in the colleciton. The article notes that 8 pairs of 20 bores? are in the collection possibly all by W. Foerster??? A W. Foerster combo of 6.6mm over 20 bore with a 4.5X Goerz scope was used in/for the Auerhahn Balz. Examples from J.P. Sauer, Triebel of Potsdam, Timner of Koblenz, Haetge of Berlin along with others were also present. It appears that W. Foerster made a pair of selfcocking 20 bore scatterguns that the Kaiser really favored for chasing fowl and hair. He began with cartridges loaded with some British black powder but found it too powerful and switched to yellow coloured cartridges by Vereinigten Koeln-Rottweiler Pulverfabriken. Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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Joined: Oct 2010
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Boxlock
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Boxlock
Joined: Oct 2010
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First of all sorry for the bad quality of this photographs, but in overall every important detail is shown there and as you see, work is done in pure English style and it’s absolutely handmade. I will start to talk about things that can’t be shown on the photos. Sincerely, the greatest discovery for me was the mechanism, I have never seen mechanism assembled with such novice springs of that time, I have searched every firearm mechanisms and as far as I verified - it’s unique. Also I was surprised seeing such system of lock on it. It’s known as “Webley’s lock” and i can only say that it’s very rare. I saw it only once on “Grant” Also, when I looked into the mechanism I was amazed with the fact that on every detail, even on the smallest clinchers, there was engraved number (2).
To be objective, I will say here that in addition I’m the owner of Purdey’s, Holland & Holland, Lancaster and more best known first class shotguns, and I will tell you in secret that despite of my knowledge in firearms I knew nothing about W.Foerster before. Maybe because that, in general I was collecting shotguns made by English gunsmiths. But, since I faced this shotgun gradually I assured that his German author was making the better English style shotguns, then his English colleagues. In overall I wanted to say that I am very surprised of the performance level of this gunsmith and especially im pleased with the fact that his works are rare and is not widespread.
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Posts: 10,818 Likes: 194
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,818 Likes: 194 |
Nikoloz: You should trade in those 2nd rate weapons you mentioned, continue your quest for more examples by W. Foerster and then concentrate your acquistions around Henrich Scherping of Hannover as well as examples by the likes of Frantisek Faukner of Prague and Johann Kalezky of Wien????? I don't think you will be disappointed by any means. On a more serious note, if you desire weapons with a British flare, search this site for examples by Heinrich Scherping. But what you are going to find is that these fellas were actually firearms merchants and they sourced the craftsmen of Belgium, Ferlach, Suhl, Weipert & Zella-Mehlis for components, longarms in the white or completed examples. I think these pics may be of a W. Foerster for the Kaiser.    Original image was compressed for some reason.  W. Foerster with a great deal of British influence. Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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