doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com RBLs Again

I have been very pleased with my first three RBLs, 20-, 28- and 16-gauge. Since receiving the RBL-16 the day after Memorial Day 2009, I have shot skeet with it and hunted it plenty, and it is fast becoming my go-to gun. The RBL-12 I got was a very heafty 32-incher at 8 pounds 14.7 ounces. It was exactly what I ordered but after I got it I knew it wasn't the gun for me. So I asked Louie to be on the lookout for a lighter RBL-12 for me, and yesterday it arrived at my local FFL. Like my others it is a straight grip with double triggers. This gun has 30-inch barrels and weighs in at a much more manageable 7 pounds 4.9 ounces.

It appears to my eye and calipers, that this RBL-12 is built on the same receiver as my RBL-16, not the receiver with the wider and higher standing breech that my first RBL-12 had.

New RBL-12 --



Top view RBL-12 above RBL-16 --



Top view RBL-16 above old heavy RBL-12 --



Breech ends of barrels of RBL-12 light and RBL-16 --



This is kind of like a Parker Bros. 12-gauge built on the 1-frame.

My 32" RBL is a heavy gun also, but I love it. It is really amazing how well a gun this big can handle so well. Very smooth and balanced.
JR

Dave, can you post pictures of your heavy 12 and tell us whether you will be selling it? I wonder if your lightweight is a one of a kind?

As I think I have posted before, my RBL-12 with 28" bbls and straight stock weighs exactly 7 pounds with the thin pad, 3.2 ounces more with the thick pad. SST and BT forend. Balanced perfectly for my uses. Guess I should take a few measurements??

Researcher, I find your report very interesting. My Ithaca NID (trap configuration) has 32" barrels, is padded out to 15 5/8" LOP, weighs 9# 2 oz, balances 5 1/2" in front of the sihgle trigger, has unmounted swing effort of 2.95, mounted swing effort of 11.73, and half weight radius of 12.24. I suspedt your heavy RBL would be similar bus slightly less swing efforts. I shoot the NID well, despite its significant muscle effort required to lift, hold, and swing. Did you ever shoot the two 12 bore RBL's "head to head?" Or, did you make a determination that you just didn't enjoy the heavier gun?

Any chance you are going to be where I could bet measurements on your guns?

Researcher,

Do you have a pic comparing the breeches of the twelve ga. guns? Also pics to compare the muzzles of the three, 12 heavy, 12 light, 16. It appears that the breech end is same as the 16 with the chambers rebored to 12 ga. by comparing the wall thickness. Very interesting addition to the RBL story. Do you know how it shoots yet?

I have a light 16 RBL that is my go to hunting gun now. I would like to try a heavy hulk 12 ga. for trap and maybe waterfowl. I am interested in why you don't care for the heavy gun. What did you intend to use it for, if I may?

Chief

The "Beast" has been gone from my presence since The Vintage Cup. I was led down the primrose path by other sporting clays shooters and their long heavy guns. I've shot my 8 pound 9 ounce Super-Fox for over forty-six years, but my 9 pound half ounce Fox-Sterlingworth Wildfowl has only been in the field once where in my opinion was it handled like a railroad tie. For eleven years I shot a Remington 3200 tube set at skeet which weighed over 9 pounds. Some guns got it and some don't!! For me that heavy RBL-12 wasn't it. Once it was moving one way I couldn't make any corrections when the wind interfered. I should have gone with my own experience that for the last decade, my best shooting is with guns in the seven pound range -- from my smallbore Superposed New Model Skeets, to my Fox-Sterlingworth Ejector Skeet & Upland Game Gun, to my Superposed 32-inch Broadway.

I took measurements of my RBL receivers back when I first got the "Beast", but I haven't found that sheet of paper yet. The measurement across the breechballs of my RBL-16 and this new RBL-12 is 2 5/32 inch. You can see the "Beast" had a little nub between the breechballs that the smaller frame doesn't.

2 and 5/32 inches is about 54 millimeters, which got me measuring my 12g doubles, one Italian one English. They both measure 57 millimeters across the breech ends, both have barrel thickness at just over 4 mm at the breech end (just below the rim step). Both of them weigh 6,6 lbs, or 3 kilos. Seems like the source of the extra weight of the RBL 12 is in the barrels more than the action body.

Puzzle is how the RBL 12 can fit the 12 gauge barrels on the 54 mm receiver. The dimensional "squeeze" probably is in the middle part, between the barrels. In the photo is seems like the 16 has a narrower lump than the 12.

The way to determine if the big 12 and the little 12 are different receiver forgings is to measure the distance between firing pins. Firing pin separation determines barrel interchange capability. Everything else can usually be filed into place. Some of the 12 gauge RBLs are real horses, but I have never measured them.

So, is the RBL 16 built on a true 16ga frame, or on a light 12ga frame? I have a friend whose 16 is pretty heavy (7+), which is fine for him, because he uses it for targets and does not hunt. But most guys looking for 16's are after field guns, not target guns. If you want a 7#+ target gun, there are plenty of 12's out there to fill the bill, and reloading for them is more practical.