doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Timeline on Daly's & Witten Excelsior steel??

1895 seems quite early for a SBT; how about that.

From GGCA #37 pg 10:

"While D.M. Lefever was the first large American company to introduce a SBT for the American market in 1905, SD&G actually best Ithaca(1914), Parker(1917), and Fox(1919) to the new market with its first Daly SBT model in 1912."

Schoverling, Daly & Gales had the pulse of the American sportsman, trap shooter, etc. so I was a little puzzled that they were so late to the game. They donated trophies and I'm sure had a shooter at most events. With the January 1909 advert noting a Daly SBT in hand, I'd say it came out in 1908 with the idea possibly near the time Lefever entered the market. Fred Adolph offered one by at least 1912, that was 32" and weighed in at 7 3/4 lbs. It may have been special order. At the same time there was quite a wait for either the Daly SBT or Westley Richards.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

The Prechtel first appeared at the Cleveland Cartridge & Target Co. tournament in Cleveland, Ohio June 1897

Oh yes, Prechtel:

http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbt...true#Post193483

M-4 made me aware of this Franz J�ger trap and I'm curious to when it dates:

http://www.gunsinternational.com/detail.cfm?gun_id=100277051

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Baker Gun and Forging Co. offered their single barrel trap in 1909. They made approx. 1500 of these gun until 1919.

Were there any SBTs assembled by H&D Folsom after Christmas 1919?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Raimey, I think there were ads for single barrel traps during the earliest of the Folsom era. I am not sure where same might have been assembled, but some workmen did move to Norwich in the change over period. The reason I am guessing on the assembly of the traps in other than Batavia is that I see the latest traps in the Baker serial no. range and there seems to be no loss in quality, unlike the doubles.

This is Researcher's c. 1922 Folsom catalog #18





Baker SBTs were not in the late 20s catalog #23

Just to post a few images of the Franz J�ger SBT, which looks to be for the American market. Trying to get images of the touchmarks:







Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

To hijack this thread a bit farther, I ran across a SBT on what looks to be a Burkhard Behr type action with the phrase "Finished by L.C. Siner & Co." on the Behr like lockup. So it must have been peddled in Philadelphia from a concern that was an extension of John Krider. Maybe Dr. McPhail has additional info. Seems John Krider hung out his shingle in 1837 and expired in circa 1887 when a John T. Siner acquired the business. Circa 1903 a Leander C. Siner, probably a son, partnered with Charles Mohr to steer the concern, which seems to have faltered in the mid 1930s(1899-1931?). In the mid 1800s the John Krider concern looks to have mixed and matched with Joseph C. Grubb & Company, which along with the John Prey Lower thread hits at Grubb's influence. At some point info suggests that a Russian minister was attempting to place an order(s) with John Krider for folks back in Russian. Anyway, I think the SBT to have been sourced from Behr but I don't know if he had a DRGM/Gebrauchsmuster for a SBT or not. It seems to fall under DRP 154950 of 1904 and that would aide in dating as Leander C. was at the helm at that time. Interesting that Leander C. Siner notes that his concern only finished it. Seems he was truthful.













http://www.gunsinternational.com/L-C-Siner-Single-Barrel-Trap-12-GA.cfm?gun_id=100255771

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse