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Forums10
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Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,986 Likes: 299
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,986 Likes: 299 |
I waited until the mud dried up to post.
People are lousy shots.
That's OK with me.
Just go to a marsh at dawn. Pow, Pow, Pow,.....Pow, Pow, Pow.....Pow, Pow, Pow,....over and over again. Until the first flight is over.
The go to the woods.
Pow, Pow,.....Pow, Pow,.... over and over, all day. Sometimes it's Pow, Pow, Pow,...
I can't see how anyone that is actually out there observing the public would see/hear anything different.
The public hunter is in aggregate, a lousy shot.
That's OK by me.
It's probably always been so.
Except for wealthy retirees, the likelihood of people devoting ten's of thousands of dollars into improving their skills, is such a statistical vagary as to be insignificant.
As in, for every 1 person that might do that, there is 100 that can't do that. But they can buy a license.
I don't even care what chokes you use. You'll be disposing of your own birds. Blown to pieces, or neck wrung.
Some of us maintain kennels just so that all the lousy shots can have their cripples rounded up. It's the good fun more that the first shot kill % for some of us.
I don't care if my hunting friends are good shots or not. It's about the fun we are having being out there.
Out there doing it best I can.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,379 Likes: 105
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,379 Likes: 105 |
On one of the farms in which I hunt in Iowa, the owner restricts access to a few people. One of them had permission to hunt himself, but brought a few friends one day. He reported to her that they'd hunted, and lost something like 5 birds. That ended his permission to hunt.
A good dog can make a poor shot look a lot better, but I hate to rely on the dogs to that extent. I do most of my hunting with people who shoot reasonably well, and who know enough not to shoot when it's too long a chance for them to be very likely to kill it.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 9,350
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 9,350 |
Larry, you're self-regulating, as I am. I don't hunt with those who don't respect the birds or the land. I'm there for enjoyment without aggravation of the senses. Mom said I'd be judged by the people I hang around.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,982 Likes: 106
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,982 Likes: 106 |
Well Mr. Brown let's just say your ideas are vastly different from mine. In my hormone charged youth my favorite pheasant gun was a ten pound 1889 Remington 10 bore. One barrel loaded with #2's and the other with #4's. The long shots were mine in our hunting party. 40 yards I would start to think about pulling a trigger. I sure would have had fun cleaning the air on your client's misses and making your dogs go the extra mile. Now I'm on a downhill pull to 60 years old and the guns are now seven pound 12 bores. The chokes remain the same Full/Mod, still #4's and I still like the long shots. Unfortunately, the vast majority of pheasant hunters can't hit 40+ yard shots at pheasants--or when they do, they're more likely to only cripple the birds, then lose them, rather than kill them cleanly. Tom Roster's steel shot lethality tests on pheasants--preserve birds rather than wild ones, which are easier to bag--showed that of those birds hit inside 30 yards, all but 2 out of 68 were recovered. A wounding loss rate of 3%. That compares to a wounding loss rate of 15% for birds at 40 yards or beyond. Of the 1300-odd wild roosters shot between 1987-2006 over my dogs--4 shorthairs, a pointer, a Gordon setter, an English setter, and a Brittany--we had a wounding loss rate of 6%. Looking at birds lost, the longer it takes a dog to get to the bird in question, the greater the chances of losing the bird. That's true whether it's due to a bird hit at longer range, or one hit with some other factor that gives a crippled bird more of a head start (woven wire fence, road, waterway with steep banks etc). A more open choke means a greater chance for the average hunter to bag birds at closer range. At 30 yards, 1 1/8 oz 6's through a cyl choke should kill pheasants; 1 1/4 oz 6's through IC should be good at close to 40 yards. Beyond that, where most people will either miss or only cripple, you do need to be a much better than average shot, and use a tighter choke and larger shot to put birds down for the count. Larry: I'm mainly a Grouse and Quail hunter, hence my fondness for open choked guns; however, I have hunted wild pheasants a few times, and to be frank I think tighter chokes are better for wild pheasants. I'm a decent shot and it's hard to tear up a pheasant. So for me, I would prefer a tighter choke where I could really clobber one. Maybe I'm wrong, but if I was going wild pheasant hunting, and knowing how those birds like to run and get up a ways out there sometimes, I would at least want a light mod if not tighter choke. Tame pheasants on the other hand are easy to kill with a skeet gun and #8 shot.....but not wild ones.
Last edited by buzz; 04/02/14 08:33 PM.
Socialism is almost the worst.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,379 Likes: 105
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,379 Likes: 105 |
Buzz, experiences will vary. Talking with Bob Crandall--and we've both shot a LOT of wild pheasants--we're pretty much on the same page: Most shots are relatively close. And if they're on the fringe of range, you can likely walk a bit farther and find another one. But I'll add that we're both used to hunting in pretty good pheasant country (even though, sadly, it's getting worse everywhere!), usually in small groups, and behind good dogs. Can't recall whether I included the story here, but my last pheasant hunt of last season was in Iowa in January. Cold, windy, and the birds had been hunted--not conditions under which pheasants are expected to "behave". Yet in less than 2 hours, my partner and I flushed 6 roosters. 2 were way out of range. The other 4: all within 25 yards. And that's with Iowa bird numbers in the toilet.
However, experiences may vary. If you're experiencing longer chances wherever you're hunting, then you want to adjust accordingly. Personally, however, I haven't seen a higher % of longer shots since the population has taken a nosedive. I've seen fewer shots with more time and boot leather separating them, but not more longer shots.
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 13,879 Likes: 15
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 13,879 Likes: 15 |
Seems like all upland hunting went to HIAHB all at once a couple years ago.
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,065
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,065 |
Cylinder and full are a nice combination in a double barrel two trigger gun.
Chuck I'll bite: What is HIAHB?
I am glad to be here.
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,850
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,850 |
Mike----Hell In A Hand Basket. 
Practice safe eating. Always use a condiment.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 9,350
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 9,350 |
Mike, that's the way my 1889 16ga Parker hammer 0 frame came from the factory. My son on first hunt killed a passing widgeon first shot well outside the decoys---right barrel---and had no interest in hunting after that. He may have thought it too easy!
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,986 Likes: 299
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,986 Likes: 299 |
What qualifies as HIAHB, Chuck?
Is it a measure of shot opportunities/hr walked?
I ask because I am accustomed to a certain level of exertion per bird shot at. Consequently, I have come to feel short changed when the effort is too small. An example might be shooting a triple in SoDak 5 minutes after 10AM.
That's a waste of the drive to me.
I'm with Larry and Bob in the belief that we need not panic at every flush, as though it is the last we'll ever see. Once you know the quarry, you gain confidence that tells you, you can find another, and you don't need to worry about "Hail Mary" type shots. Some men hunt a lifetime and never achieve that understanding. No one scolds me if I come home empty handed.
I'm curious what level of harvest is acceptable to the lease investors. It's a different situation than what I have, so I often wonder if they measure their satisfaction more directly to bag and cash outlay than I do.
Out there doing it best I can.
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