doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Laser Engraving

I don't think anyone would claim to be a "fan" of laser engraving. But makers are pushing for improvements in quality, and they are showing up. Compare the following three photos. The first is a recently made Caesar Guerini with laser engraving (they claim that the engraving is hand finished, but don't specify what that means exactly). The second is a Cole Custom hand engraved (and signed) by an Italian engraver. The third is a hand engraved Arrieta. All three guns cost roughly the same. {Sorry the pics are not all of the same quality].

Correct....call them what you will, imperfections one way or another

mabe we will have a resurrection of a craftsman type period.everything we love about the classic ,antique, guns is missing from the laser /roll stamped guns.

Can many people tell the difference, without a magnifying glass, between the Boxall and Edminston style of laser engraving and hand cut and sculpted work? I have my doubts. Especially on the heavier styles with deep relief and stippled ground heavily inked.

I mean variations executed as intended -- I think of imperfections as unintended.

I can certainly make the difference. As someone else said laser engraving is dead and lifeless.
It's like having a fake fire using gas instead of wood... It does warm you up, but I completely fail to see the reason to go there in the first place.
Of course, those things do sell, so I am probably wrong in a commercial way.

Best regards,
WC-

There is no need for a resurrection - there are more than a few good engravers out there today. AA Brown lists engraving costs (2012) as an additional $6-25k on top of a $60k base price for a new gun. That engraving cost alone is more than many people are prepared to spend on a shotgun.

The reality is that it is a whole lot cheaper to buy good engraving on a vintage gun than it is to buy it on a new gun. If you are buying a new gun, hand engraving is simply too expensive for most buyers (unless you are willing to consider a Turkish gun).

Oh the irony of it all! MC is a VERY talented engraver.

As someone who handles the commissioning of engraving fairly regularly, I would disagree about the costs being prohibitive. Very nice engraving can be had without mortgaging the farm, but usually not from a top tier UK maker.

What might be more impressive than laser engraving is EDM, or electrical discharge machining. I've been told that process is what Beretta has been using for years on their Silver Pigeon 686-7 line of o/u's. The Silver Pigeon II is the most amazing of these, in my opinion. The heavy-chiseled effect on the side panels of the receiver on these guns is remarkable in its depth and quality, rivaling hand engraving to the point that many wouldn't know the difference. A laser just cannot achieve this same effect yet.

I have a Beretta Gallery SPII 20 ga with 30" wide rib barrels, which is a late '90's gun, that has a darker, richer nickel finish than some of the later guns in this model, and the engraving never ceases to impress me with its quality and detail every time I take it out.

My apologies to MC if it appeared like I was trying to tell him something he did not know about his craft.

And I am not trying to suggest laser engraving is aesthetically equivalent to hand engraving. If there is something prettier than the hand engraving on Lindner Daly Diamond grade, I have yet to see it. But based on my experience, commissioning hand engraving for a new gun is either very complicated or expensive. Most makers of production guns won't sell them in the white. Perazzi allows you to order hand engraving but for a gun that will cost at least $15k and more likely $20k. Rich Cole was offering an option for hand engraved Berettas but has stopped. Guerini claims that their guns can be ordered with custom engraving but my several inquiries with them about that have made it clear that they really are not interested in making that happen.

Even "lower end" bespoke guns with hand engraving will run $15k or more. Spanish guns with quality hand engraving (like an Arrieta 801) cost ~$15k. Verney Carron will allow you to order custom engraving on their Atelier guns, but those run $15k+. You can order custom engraving for a CSMC Foxes but that will run well over $20k.

You can buy a vintage gun with little or no engraving like a Fox Sterly and have it custom engraved. Based on what I learned, that can easily become a $10k project and will almost certainly result in a loss if the gun is ever sold. Plus there are the potential risks with annealing and rehardening the action to allow for the engraving.

I don't mean to suggest that the value of hand engraving is not worth the investment, but the market reality is that a new gun with hand engraving requires at least a $15-20k investment.

I am not trying to be a wet blanket - please tell me I am missing something.