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#446351 - 06/08/16 08:24 AM Ferlach ?? for Raimey
Run With The Fox Offline
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Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6911
Loc: Michigan
I am seriously looking at a Ferlach 12 Bochflintte- a Flaig's import- Forever Yours SN 4386-- 2.75" (70mm) chambers 26" even (not metric length barrels, ventilated rib, gold inset at near breech area Forever Yours in script- Kersten top fastening system,selective ejectors, Merkel style 3 pc. small wood forearm-0- pg with cap, goegeous Circassian? walnut 22 lpi checking- Pachmyer ventilated pad that looks like it grew out of the wood- small checkpiece, NO sling swivels- SST with side shift selector as in a Browning Superposed- 95" condition- only German wording on this shotgun is after Bohler- Stahl for Steel- Flaigs 1971 catalog shows this Forever Yours retailing at $975.--with the SST--$900 with DT-- I don't have fotos, sorry, but from this brief description, what price range would I be facing, from a private party seller-- When I removed the forearm and released the barrels, and saw the engine turned forearm iron and the ejector push rods, I felt like the first time I saw a Steinway Grand piano with the top lid open and propped up- Wow--
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#446354 - 06/08/16 08:54 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
ellenbr Offline
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 8709
Loc: North Alabama
Me thinks Flaig's sourced from Sodia and had the tradename Forever Yours - applied. Francis, does it resemble the below?

http://www.nramuseum.org/guns/the-galler...er-shotgun.aspx

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

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#446372 - 06/08/16 11:44 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: ellenbr]
Run With The Fox Offline
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Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6911
Loc: Michigan
Yes, mein Fruend- wir sim Gebruderen Bochflintten- dead nutz id-- what might such a "Steinway" be worth in today's market??
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#446391 - 06/08/16 03:16 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
montenegrin Offline
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Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 1682
Loc: Slovenia
Another 'Forever Yours' was made by Ferlach's Benedikt Winkler and valued at 4,000-6,000 by a well known auction house back in 2005.

With kind regards,
Jani

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#446395 - 06/08/16 03:59 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
ellenbr Offline
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Francis, I don't think you'd want to invest more that say $1800 U.S. of A. in that Sodia while Winkler's wares might fetch a bit more as Jani notes.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

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#446399 - 06/08/16 04:43 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: ellenbr]
Run With The Fox Offline
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Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6911
Loc: Michigan
Danke- I have a feeling that the seller wants $2.5 for it- the figure in that wood, the fit, feel and balance--like a Strad violin, not that I have ever handled one. As Bogie said in "The Maltese Falcon" "The stuff dreams are made of"! Of course, if Sir John Gielgud had played that Sam Spade role, he might have said it thusly: "Indeed, the stuff of which dreams are made"-- Either way, I don't get knocked over a barrel on very many shotguns, whether side-by-side or over and unders, but this one-took my breath away- but, thanks to your sound advice, not my 401K-- Later- Der Fuchs!!!
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#446420 - 06/08/16 08:55 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
ellenbr Offline
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 8709
Loc: North Alabama
Ah Francis, see if he'd bite on a cool $2k U.S. of A. and you become the new caretaker.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

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#446445 - 06/09/16 08:02 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: ellenbr]
Run With The Fox Offline
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Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6911
Loc: Michigan
I have that in mind. But that would be my "top dollar offer"- By the way, I went to my 2014 Fijestad Blue Book page 760- long listed of good Germanic names- but did not see Herr Franz Sodia listed therein-- I'll let you know if I end up with the gun- hope to- but it is at an auction, so who can predict the "up yours, matey" fever that seems to grip the madding crowds that sometimes gather in rural MI for farm equipment and household stuff, the rest of the guns (I had a private viewing on Monday) are "beaters"-the Ferlach is the pearl in the oyster.

Also, as I like to pay close attention to all details, there is a typo in the last line of the 3rd graph in the text on FERLACH GUNS-- they have it as "indivudal gunmaker"-should be spelled "individual gunmaker" Machts Nicht, Ja?? Danke- Der Fuchs!!
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#446448 - 06/09/16 08:20 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
ellenbr Offline
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 8709
Loc: North Alabama
Francis:

It would be a Steinway if Winkler had his hands on it. You know that it takes sand to make a pearl & I've never seen a Wells Fargo trailer behind a hearse, so if you greatly fancy it, you might want to keep raising your hand but I don't think @ auction it will realize much more. Inspect the stampings closely & see if you see 33..... & that would be Franz Sodia. Then again 37.... will be Winkler. 40..... - Ludwig Boronvik and 42..... Josef Winkler would be top shelf offerings also. Anyway, may the camel of prosperity always provide 2 humps for your comfort.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

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#446460 - 06/09/16 09:51 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: ellenbr]
Der Ami Offline
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Registered: 07/04/12
Posts: 3437
Loc: East Alabama
There were two Sodias, Franz had his own factory and ,I understand, wasn't a member of the "Genossenschaft"(?).Is 33 then Anton Sodia?.
Mike

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#446475 - 06/09/16 01:08 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
Gunwolf Offline
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Registered: 07/13/11
Posts: 869
Loc: Bonn, Germany
Fuchs, if you need a Double Rifle as a compliment to the gun:

http://www.egun.de/market/item.php?id=5838703

Cheers,
Gunwolf
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#446476 - 06/09/16 01:11 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
Gunwolf Offline
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Registered: 07/13/11
Posts: 869
Loc: Bonn, Germany
In addition the Ferlach numbers:

20= H.Scheiring-Düsel (bis Ende der 50er Stefan Düsel)
21= Johann Fanzoj
22= Josef Hambrusch
23= Karl Hauptmann
24= Josef Just
25= Martin Kruschitz *
26= Jakob Koschat
27= Simon Kalischnig*
28= Peter Mischitz*
29= Josef Mischitz*
30= Josef Orasche
31= Michael Pegam*
32= Anton Sodia*
33= Franz Sodia
34= Johann Sigott*
35= Walter Outschar
36= Wincenz Urbas
37= Benedikt Winkler
38= Genossenschaft der Büchsenmacher
39= Fachschule für Handfeuerwaffen
40= Ludwig Borownik
41= Johann Michelitsch
42= Josef Winkler
43= Thomas Kulnig*
44= Walter Gratzer*
45= Erich Achatz*
46= Josef Schönlieb*
47= Lorenz Schaschi*
48= Johann Fanzoi
49= Franz R. Schmid*
50= Franz Schmied*
51= Josef Juch
52= Valentin Rosenzopfs Erbe*
53= Wilfried Glanznig
55= Herbert Scheiring


Cheers,
Wolfgang
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#446485 - 06/09/16 04:40 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Gunwolf]
Run With The Fox Offline
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Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6911
Loc: Michigan
Danke- Ich magt Der Ise Fuchs und dem Weidmanschied durch um Jagt, Ja. Ein gut Kalibre fur moggeweise Amerika und Europa muit unser Freunden St. Huburtus- Prosit!!
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#446486 - 06/09/16 04:41 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Gunwolf]
Run With The Fox Offline
Sidelock
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Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6911
Loc: Michigan
Danke, meine Fruende, Danke. Fuchs
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#446492 - 06/09/16 06:12 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Gunwolf]
Der Ami Offline
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Registered: 07/04/12
Posts: 3437
Loc: East Alabama
Wolfgang,
Thanks. What is the * for? Membership in the Genossenschaft? Or something else?
Mike

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#446494 - 06/09/16 06:23 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
Gunwolf Offline
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Registered: 07/13/11
Posts: 869
Loc: Bonn, Germany
Mike, it means "no longer in the Business..." :-((
Ferlach has great problems as well as the whole trade in Europe!

Cheers,
Wolfgang
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#446496 - 06/09/16 06:25 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
Gunwolf Offline
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Registered: 07/13/11
Posts: 869
Loc: Bonn, Germany
Here is the story of Franz Sodia:

https://www.sodia-exclusiv.com/en/our-story/

Wolfgang
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#446498 - 06/09/16 06:36 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
Gunwolf Offline
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Registered: 07/13/11
Posts: 869
Loc: Bonn, Germany
Mike, interesting article about Ferlach, hope you can understand some of the german text:

https://www.all4shooters.com/it/Tiro/cultura/Armaioli-di-Ferlach/Ferlach.pdf

Wolfgang
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#446660 - 06/11/16 06:01 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Gunwolf]
Run With The Fox Offline
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Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6911
Loc: Michigan
Alles ist verruckt mit der Geld wir dem kostenlos fur Bockflinten heute-- Holy Moley- that sweet Ferlach "Forever Yours" made by Herr Sodia in 1954- hammered down at $5250- plus: 10% buyer's premium, 6% sales tax and 4% plastic money charge- I dropped out when the bidding got close to $1900.00 Der Fuchs. Auction fever?? Who can say..
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#446661 - 06/11/16 06:16 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
Gunwolf Offline
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Registered: 07/13/11
Posts: 869
Loc: Bonn, Germany
Total verrückt!!! That is very much - this one could become yours for less, but unfortunately it's in Germany...:

Sodia BBF

Cheers,
Wolfgang


Edited by Gunwolf (06/11/16 06:17 PM)
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#446690 - 06/11/16 08:52 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Gunwolf]
Der Ami Offline
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Registered: 07/04/12
Posts: 3437
Loc: East Alabama
Wolfgang,
Thanks for the info. My favorite drilling is a post WW2 Franz Sodia.
Mike

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#446700 - 06/11/16 10:46 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Gunwolf]
ellenbr Offline
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 8709
Loc: North Alabama
Originally Posted By: Gunwolf
Total verrückt!!! That is very much - this one could become yours for less, but unfortunately it's in Germany...:

Sodia BBF

Cheers,
Wolfgang


Wolfgang: That's much more in line.

Francis: I think you were wise to cease & desist @ $1900 U.S. of A. as I just do not believe that the future custodian of the Sodia, not including premiums, will ever see any return on the venture. Maybe, just maybe on a Winkler or Borownik ?

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

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#446714 - 06/12/16 08:30 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: ellenbr]
Run With The Fox Offline
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Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6911
Loc: Michigan
I owe that "wisdom" to your input, Raimey. That and living to nearly 75 years has taught me to be very careful at auctions. This was the first one operated by the Amish folks, out of Clare, MI-very well run, 4 rings- plus I learned more about older Winchesters while perusing the table where almost 50 shotguns and rifles (.22 and center fire as well)- from a few older gents who were detailing all the points of non-originality on some Model 94 and Model 62 and 1906 rifles. Day well spent, and my 401K is still intact.

FWIW- about 2 years ago- summer outside auction with a few good ticket gun items, the key point was a VH 16 gauge Parker, which sold for $1100 to a young Amish lad who was next to me in the bidding. About 1912 vintage 30" DT, Ext- 50% wood and metal 20% case colors-- I dropped out at $700- as I had checked it out during the inspection hour- It was a 12 gauge (I always carry snap caps and a choke gauge and a Stanley 6 ft. tape rule to gun shows and auctions-- 30" F&F 12- not a 16 as the tag indicated. The strange "rest of the story" was, the lad turned to a friend and said- Great- I just bought a full case of 16 gauge shotshells at a yard sale last week, and now I have a shotgun to shoot them with. Alas- stay well!! Der Fuchs
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#566927 - 03/09/20 11:35 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Gunwolf]
Niemann Offline
Boxlock
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Registered: 08/25/12
Posts: 26
Loc: Fife and Pine Plains
Originally Posted By: Gunwolf
In addition the Ferlach numbers:


51= Josef Juch



Cheers,
Wolfgang


Is Juch et al still in business? Do you have contact information?

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#566975 - 03/09/20 09:16 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
ellenbr Offline
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 8709
Loc: North Alabama
http://www.jagdwaffen-juch-grund-ferlach.at/kontakt.php

http://www.jagdwaffen-juch-grund-ferlach.at/


Karl Grund
Büchsenmacher

Max Guglerstraße 7
D-93333 Neustadt/Donau
Tel: +49(0)9445/2689
Mobil: +49(0)1728221810
Mail: karl-grund@t-online.de

Can't say if they are still in business or not. Call them on WhatsApp.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

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#570054 - 04/19/20 07:35 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
felix Offline
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Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 127
An den Hochwohlgeborenen Herrn Fuchs !
A Sodia scion is still in business , operating from an
outlet/take-over-facility in Vienna.
A friend of mine has handed him over a gun recently
for restocking.
I met this Mr. Sodia when he was operations manager
of Springers flagship store in downtown Vienna.
He is now on his own.
Prices for Ferlach Bockflinten are down next to
nothing.
....
Nick Holt had in his last auction an Anton
Sodia SLE O/U for 1,5 KGBP
.....
I see from the thread dates that you are or
approaching 80.
I have observed 3 patterns of behaveour with the
male of the Primaten-species "H.o.m.o sapiens" arriving
at this watershed 80.
A. Ceasing with all the beloved/known activities,
fall into deep depression,
becoming bigoted and be ready to pass away.
B. Continue to live as always
as nothing dramatically could happen.
C. "Terminale Euphorie" , a terminus coined by a
friend of mine , a retired gynaecologist,
Defining a pattern to squeeze everything
not realized before 80 into the remaining time
( for instance the greatest stag in Hungary, the
greatest Marlin, ...etc)
...
I believe it has been the cynic Voltaire, who when
asked when playing cards, what he would do
when he knew he would die in one hour..
His dry answer was "continue to play cards"
....
In case you are in quaratine caused by this
Morbus Wuhanitis, there is gunporno alias
Morhy-auction-internet-catalogue available.
If you consider to play in another league
than Ferlach Bockflinte you have ample choices
there.
For instance a newish Lebeau O/U SLE a-la-Boss with
gorgeous Liege-style-engraving.
(The Russian czar has been shooting with a Lebeau
Anson pair, his brother had a pair of Boss,
on the market at Sothebys in the 1990's)
Or a Fabbri O/U or a Bertuzzi...
...
Wear a mask, dont leave the house, allow yourself more than
one of the great Califonian cabernets or chardonays, emulate
Voltaire/option B and stay healthy
....
Weidmannsheil
FN


Edited by felix (04/19/20 07:51 AM)

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#570056 - 04/19/20 08:13 AM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
ellenbr Offline
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Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 8709
Loc: North Alabama
Remain ever stalwart FN, as I find it most intoxicating......


Cheers,

Raimey
rse

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#572907 - 05/27/20 03:24 PM Re: Ferlach ?? for Raimey [Re: Run With The Fox]
bavarianbrit Offline
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Registered: 02/25/10
Posts: 218
Loc: Bavaria, Germany
Hi Raimey,
My pal here in Bavaria has two son"s at the Ferlach school at present time. He runs a one man gun shop so might be expanding soon unless they meet some nice frauleins down there.

All the best

Martin

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