doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com weight reduction from opening chokes

I recently weighed the barrels from my A grade A. H. Fox. The chambers had been lengthened to 3" before I bought the gun years ago, and it had been recased and restocked in Bo Whoop style with a 15 1/4" straight hand butt and a semi-beavertail. The 32" barrels weighed 3lbs. 15.6 ounces. They were choked .037" and .038". After using the gun several years I made the decision to let Charlie Boswell open the chokes for me. They are now .015" and .025" and pattern spot on and beautifully. I intend to reweigh the barrels out of curiosity on the same digital scales to see what the weight reduction is. I don't expect very much reduction, and can feel no difference. Anyone want to hazard a guess as to what the scales will tell?

3 lbs. 15.5 ounces

3 lbs. 15.61 oz.

Considering several years have passed since last weighed, and the sun has enlarged and our orbit decayed, I'll go with them being 3lbs 15.62 if weighed at night when opposite the sun and 3lbs 15.6 during day....unlesssss Jupiter is in the night sky aligned opposite the sun, thennnn they could weigh around 3lbs 15.599998 oz.

Are you serious? Too much time on your hands? The difference is the square root of sod all, in fact.
Mike

Tough room!

jack

seeing as there is now less metal at the muzzle, that must therefore mean that there is more room for air, and as air is significantly more dense in your part of the world due to the moisture content attracting pheromones and associated carbon dioxide, allied to the impact of the location of the barrels impact on the earths orbit, due to the removal of the metal reducing the prior subsequent orbitting speed by one tenth of .7689 second this therefore would result in the barrels being heavier - simple really. Did any body REALLY read this far???? ;-

seriously though, I would be interested to know the difference - educated guess 1 ounce less !

Jonty

Nah, if there's one thing I don't have it is too much time on my hands. Just a big curiosity. It hasn't been a long time since I weighed them, though. I wasn't very clear in my earlier post on that. I weighed them last week and then had the chokes opened. We'll see what they weigh today, when I ride back down there.

You're right about one thing, Jonty. The air is dense here this time of year! Humidity and gnats!

I'm guessing an ounce or less.

Stan

One of the things to consider is, were the barrels oiled or waxed before the first weigh in and if they are oiled or waxed now. If oiled, did you use a 5w oil or a heavier 40w oil?

Assuming the chokes had parallels not over an inch long the most that could be expected would be less than ¼oz. That is figured from a .729 bore with .015" in both bbls vs .038" originally in both bbls, so will actually be less than that.

What is the sQuare rewt of sod ?

I opened the chokes in a pair of Lefever'Optimus'12b bbls. Orig. choke Dim were both L/R 041" Opened the L to .005" rt to .009". I kept a magnet under paper when cleaning off the 'Swarf'.The total weight I collected with the cutting oil, was 3/4 of oz.This was not a 'Real precision measurement'I used my 'Postal scale'I have a photo of the 3/4oz in a plastic container in the W/shop. cc/dt

I did a swag at the metal volume removed and it doesn't look like it could be more than 0.3 oz total. But that was generous on metal removal. So, my real guess is 3lbs 15.4 oz.

Miller and Chuck are right on, in fact, Chuck is exactly right. The barrels weighed back in at 3 lbs. 15.4 oz. Good cypherin' guys.

So, will I have a lot of problem with gettin' too far in front of a slow crosser, now? Maybe Jonty can help me figure if a left or a right crosser will take less muzzle speed due to continental drift.

It took me several years to decide to open those chokes, and I may not have done it if the gun had still been original, but since it had been re-everythinged already............. It'll be much more useful now. The big HE will remain as is as long as it's mine, .042 and .043.

Due to the extra speed of the swing, if the swing were in a north/south direction, the extra gyroscopic effect of the earth's rotation could cause you to either fall forward or backward, depending on which way you were facing.

This post makes me want to hang up my guns.
The thought of being associated with such lunacy
really bothers me. I'm serious.

Would the speed of swing be faster North or South of the Equator ?

It would be the same if you were the same distance from the equator north or south, but in a different direction. The biggest adjustment would have to be made, naturally, if one were ON the equator.

You guys are gunna be REALLY disappointed......not one mention of the Solunar Tables...if ya messed with those chokes in a minor period and fired 'em in a major.....it might shoot BACKWARDS!!!...or meybe just twice as fast, "Midnight Magnum" ?

Good fer witches and bats?

Your Humble Heathen,
666

Stan,
Could you please furnish me with the original dimensions please? Also I would require the current dimensions to promolgate the actual amount of metal removed, also it would be useful if you knew what the actual barrel material is because this obviously affects the specific density and metallurgical make up.No problem if this is not to hand as I am not too far from Sheffield which used to be the steel industry capital and no doubt I can find the information from their reference library.If that draws a blank I have a friend who was a representative for Bohler steels in Austria before they went tits up due to the burgeoning Chinese economy, which incidentally is funded by Brits & Yanks who have moved their businesses out there due to Union interference and the ever shortening working week, which in Germany as become a major problem as they seem to have a religious festival which takes place nearly every week on a Friday which means that the workforce is usually intoxicated all weekend running into the following week with sickness before running into the following weeks festival, which may not be as bad as France who have a complete shut down in August.If you could let me have those dimensions I would appreciate it.Failing that if you post me your address I could come over and stay with you for a month and we could do the calculations hands on, which would probably be a better idea anyway. So I will just go and pack a flight bag and await your reply. I don't have a problem with a visa because when I went to the American Embassy and spoke to the lady their she transferred me to another man in fact I was transferred a lot but they gave me a visa very quickly and waved me goodbye . I will see you later, I'll ring from the airport when I touch down. Don't worry if it takes a long time to come and collect me, I'll find someone to talk to.Bye.

ROTFLMAO,

Stan

Dear Salopian,
If Stan won't put you up for a month, I will. We can work the barrel weight calculations at night and since I know you are an accomplished craftsman, we can finish that remodel of my mother's bathroom (loo to you) and then the termite damage to my house, just some basic carpentry. Later, we can do that remodel of my wife's kitchen and bath. By the time we're all done, it'll be hunting season and we can then see if all the poo I've picked up was worth it's weight, if that dog will hunt. If this offer of conscripted labor seems attractive, please ... well maybe we can just do a foreign exchange program where we trade places.

.015 and .025? Why didn't you just buy a Stevens Model 311 in .410 if you just wanted to shoot sparrows? However, I don't fault DT for blowing the Optimus out to skeet dimensions. Maybe Lefever Arms Company will sponsor him on the NSSA competition circuit for 2008, Murphy

ROTFLMAO?
Give me clue ?

rollin on the ground and laughin my axe off

Chuck H., that's floor.

Murphy, the chokes it had were too tight for anything I would need it for other than pass shooting ducks, and I have scant opportunity for that. However, the lt. mod. and imp. mod. will be great for work in the green timber. It will also be much more useful for sporting clays in the S x S events I shoot. Remember, todays loads will pattern the .025" just as tightly as the original chokes did the shells of that day. It'll kill ducks with Bismuth and Tungsten Matrix as far as I need to be shooting them.

Sparrows you say. Crows is the nearest thing to sparrows this Fox will ever work on.

Stan

Chuck H, You'd like it here except we are not allowed sharp objects, belts, or shoe laces. But my room has lovely soft walls, in fact I think they are padded.It is very secure, bars on the windows and lots of locks on the doors, but they won't let me have my guns, the Doctor just smiles and says "maybe tomorrow, we'll see"

Murph....The Old saying the Customer is 'Always Right'!!!The Client has a 'Stable' Of Lefevers, I have opened several of his Guns to his 'Favored Choice of Chokes'. He has Shot many times in England, Cornwall, in particular.Has 'Smoked-up a Storm" at Geoff Gaebe'sTower-Shoots.I made up a 'Composed Pair' of 12bore Optimus( I'm sure somebody noted more open choke in the Left Bbl.) I also Set the Stocks to Cast-In, and did a Trigger job' for a 'Lefty'. cc/dt

Actually H J0E, in English conversation, the result is the "square root of Fxxx all", from a rude limerick concerning a young man from Bengal who had a mathmatical ball, perhaps Crosschisles can chime in here if he ever sang rugby songs in his youth! "if I give you half a crown, can I pull your knickers down?" and other ribaldry, holy cow, I have not used that word
in yonks! Proving I am a genuine Limey.
Mike, off for a gin!

Mike ,When on long(15-20 mile marches0 in the KRRC, Green Jackets Brigade) May 1960-April 1962. The 'Songs' That were Sung by the 40 Sweating Cursing National Servicemen, Being driven like a herd of Bollocks..Whoops Freudian Slip!! Bullocks, NCOs whacking your arse with their Ebony 'Swagger Sticks" The songs that were sung would be just unbelivable if they could have been "Put on Tape"..London Cockneys, Brummie Factory workers,Welsh boys"From the Sheep Pens On the Hills" Dorset boys from the Fishing Boats...Monty Python Picked up a 'Load of Stuff' from that Era of British Culture!!!!Rude Limericks were the Rule of the Day...and most Nights!!!!Purdeys Workshop had some of the most Ribald Poets at the Benches when I was there....Oh boy, They are coming back from that dark area of storage...Couple of "Pints" of Real Stuff....We'll be singing at the "Setting-Bench"There's something wrong with my Barrel 'Mike", Its Stuck in the Bore of this Boss Gun.....There were 3 Monks of Great Renown who roamed the streets of London Town......The Wife has just dragged me up from the Workshop.....Gunmaking can be Fun!!!!CC/dt "ALL in JEST"

Shakespeare was a man of wit, on his shirt he had some !!!!! ?Buttons.
One day while walking by St.Pauls a Prossie grabbed him by his !!!? Arm.
You look a man of Pluck come with me and have a !!!!? Sandwich.
Whether a tanner or whether a bob it all depends on the size of your !!!! ? Sandwich

No wonder you guys lost the Revolutionary War.

we didn't - it was all a trick to lure you yanks into a false sense of security!! we are STILL in charge...

tee hee, tongue firmly in cheek !

Jonty

I can see why everythings so screwed up over here now...

Whassamatta Benis? A bee stung me! Where'd he sting you, Benis? He stung me on the [pick one] member, knob, penis, knee, Obviously the answer is "knee" to make the rhyme with "me". The power of words can be so exhilerating--when you're about nine yrs. old.

jack

Or....Sixty Nine.....!!!!cc/Dt