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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,033 Likes: 45
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,033 Likes: 45 |
treb, there's one screwdriver in the world that exactly fits that thing - that being the one they put it together with.
That screwdriver is in Germany which makes field service a tad inconvenient.
The idea of handmade 'perfect' workmanship is not lost on me. I 'get' that part.
My point is that this can coexist with serviceability in the modern age.
"The price of good shotgunnery is constant practice" - Fred Kimble
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,033 Likes: 45
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,033 Likes: 45 |
Ha! I just went down to the 'gun room' (garage) to swab out my K-20 after a fine weekend in pursuit of the wily clay target, and guess what holds the trigger plate in?
I likely noticed before but apparently forgot...
It looks to be a Torx head screw. It has 6 points, but I can't tell if it's standard or not since the guard is in the way.
So, they know about Torx 'style' fasteners in Germany and they have made it as far up the food chain as Krieghoff.
"The price of good shotgunnery is constant practice" - Fred Kimble
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,966 Likes: 293
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,966 Likes: 293 |
Serviceability by who?
Most of these remarks are from can'ts attacking can's.
I'm sure if you found your way to the front of the line at H&W, all your screws would be facing longitudinally at delivery.
Out there doing it best I can.
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 159
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 159 |
Regarding Torx, Phillips, Allen, or whatever non-slotted head pattern you choose, they too have a symmetry. So if you are the "highly observant" type concerned about alignment you'll notice those as well. They're harder to notice but much harder to align . Just a thought. Jeremy
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,444 Likes: 204
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,444 Likes: 204 |
....there's one screwdriver in the world that exactly fits that thing - that being the one they put it together with.
That screwdriver is in Germany which makes field service a tad inconvenient.
The idea of handmade 'perfect' workmanship is not lost on me. I 'get' that part.... My guess would be that it is not a one off slot with a matching one off bit to fit it. It's likely a machine cut slot to some in house standard. All it has to do is appear 'fine'. For a very few dollars, I'd think some torx screws could be sent along with the gun with the buyer having the choice of which set was on when the gun is delivered. That particular example appears to have 'fine' English rose and scroll engraving. The roses of the 'fine' engraving look like torx heads to me. While the scroll is 'fine' in its size, there's almost no shading. Maybe, it's a price point gun?
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,619 Likes: 72
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,619 Likes: 72 |
No Best maker would have let it out of the shop like that.
Mike Proctor
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 11,313 Likes: 378
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 11,313 Likes: 378 |
Apparently, this photo is of a gun on the Hartman & Weiss website.
If you are contemplating buying one of their guns, why not contact them with a link to this particular discussion so that they will understand that the vast majority of buyers of an expensive engraved shotgun find this sort of attention to detail unacceptable?
In all likelihood, the screw just needs torqued down another fraction of a turn to align the slot. Highly doubtful it was built with a misaligned slot prior to engraving and case hardening. But that little detail should have been done before the gun was handed to a photographer for an advertising photo. Someone really dropped the ball.
It is incorrect to think that narrow slot screws cannot be removed or replaced without damage or misalignment. It simply takes more care, and the proper hollow ground screw driver. When a good gunsmith finds a screw with a slot that his drivers don't fit, he will grind a tip to fit perfectly before he ever attempts to move the screw.
A true sign of mental illness is any gun owner who would vote for an Anti-Gunner like Joe Biden.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,693 Likes: 450
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,693 Likes: 450 |
The best trick I have learned about not buggering up a screw is to never try to turn it. Hard to not do sometimes I know but I have stopped taking things apart at last. Just wish more than a few gunsmiths would do the same. I've had more than one gun returned with a screw that suffered from a trip to the gunsmith.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,966 Likes: 293
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,966 Likes: 293 |
One need only watch a video showing how that screw was fitted to the action to understand why it was just an oversight during the photography shoot.
The items the photographer wished to illuminate are very nice, in my view.
That picture has been chewed on before. So have the proud wood pictures.
I'm not even sure they are still taking orders. The principals have to be in their 80's by now.
Out there doing it best I can.
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445 Likes: 201
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445 Likes: 201 |
Craig, The screws are, indeed, one off, and the screw drivers are also. The screw originally had a very thick head, with a sacrificial slot. When every thing was fit up and turned in properly, a new slot location was marked( north and south) and either filed or sawn( with a fine blade),then the head was filed flush, polished and engraved. The screw driver would have been made to fit that screw( and others in that location in other guns made at the same workbench). When the finished screw in under or over turned, then not only is the slot noticeable, but the engraving is mismatched. With regard to scope rings, the only logical type screw to use is either Allen or Torx. Mike
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