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Joined: Jan 2006
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,426 Likes: 314 |
Terry - "Nimrod" was a Francotte tradename. The barrels are Fluid Steel, likely Acier Cockerill of Cockerill Ougree-Liege.
Manufacture dArmes Feu Ligeoise used this steel almost exclusively, and labeled the steel Acier Universel. Some Browning patent Fabrique-Nationale-Herstal very early versions of the A5 shipped to the U.S. between 1903 and 1909 are marked Cockerill Steel. And Ithaca used Cockerill Steel for Flues No. 1 Special grade double for a period.
The gun was proved for a maximum 12g load of 1 1/4 oz. / 3 1/4 Dram Eq. (1220 fps) but the usual service (using) load was similar to today: 1 1/8 oz. 3 Dr. Eq. (1200 fps). The almost 110 year old wood would likely prefer 1 oz. target loads however.
Please have the gun checked and cleaned by a double gun specialist.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,954 Likes: 12
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,954 Likes: 12 |
Welcome to this board, Terry. Very nice looking Knockabout. I'll take a whack at value for you.
My valuation system is based on market research from auctions. There are three factors considered - Brand Value level (BV), Original Quality grade (OQ), and Current Condition level (CC). Brand Value level for Francotte is BV3 (highest tier for Continental makers and the bulk of British makers). The OQ for a Knockabout is about OQ 6.5; a mid-grade boxlock ejector. Current Condition seems to be about CC2 (Limited use - slight finish wear, little shooting).
BV3-OQ6.5-CC2 = $2,600
Your gun falls into a group that represent very good "usin'" value, especially when found in high condition such as your.
Hope that helps. Post back if you have questions.
DDA
Last edited by Rocketman; 10/03/17 12:26 AM.
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Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 111
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 111 |
Terry - "Nimrod" was a Francotte tradename. The barrels are Fluid Steel, likely Acier Cockerill of Cockerill Ougree-Liege.
Manufacture dArmes Feu Ligeoise used this steel almost exclusively, and labeled the steel Acier Universel. Some Browning patent Fabrique-Nationale-Herstal very early versions of the A5 shipped to the U.S. between 1903 and 1909 are marked Cockerill Steel. And Ithaca used Cockerill Steel for Flues No. 1 Special grade double for a period.
The gun was proved for a maximum 12g load of 1 1/4 oz. / 3 1/4 Dram Eq. (1220 fps) but the usual service (using) load was similar to today: 1 1/8 oz. 3 Dr. Eq. (1200 fps). The almost 110 year old wood would likely prefer 1 oz. target loads however.
Please have the gun checked and cleaned by a double gun specialist.
Thank you for the information! So now this raises a question about reloading, I have been looking for loads that develop around 7,900 PSI, in looking at some of the reloading data there are loads that are in the pressure range that have velocities at and over 1200 FPS, so regardless of pressure are Dram eq always dependent on velocity? In other words should I be looking for loads below 1200 FPS, and not really worry about pressure, or should I be looking for both lower velocity, and pressure? Thanks again!!
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Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 111
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 111 |
Welcome to this board, Terry. Very nice looking Knockabout. I'll take a whack at value for you.
My valuation system is based on market research from auctions. There are three factors considered - Brand Value level (BV), Original Quality grade (OQ), and Current Condition level (CC). Brand Value level for Francotte is BV3 (highest tier for Continental makers and the bulk of British makers). The OQ for a Knockabout is about OQ 6.5; a mid-grade boxlock ejector. Current Condition seems to be about CC2 (Limited use - slight finish wear, little shooting).
BV3-OQ6.5-CC2 = $2,600
Your gun falls into a group that represent very good "usin'" value, especially when found in high condition such as your.
Hope that helps. Post back if you have questions.
DDA
Thank you for this!!! I had no idea, I kind of feel a little guilty now...just a little  I feel like I practically stole it, best investment I ever made, the down side now I'm not sure I want to go shoot it!! Yeah like that's going to happen. Thanks again Terry
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,426 Likes: 314
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,426 Likes: 314 |
Terry: the long version of "what load should I use" is toward the bottom here https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZIo0y746UsSRZIgRuuxwAbZjSBHitO_EanvwLYc-kGA/editThe medium version is "loads for which the gun was designed" with a recognition that both pressure and recoil (load weight and fps) matter, and the mechanical lock up and wood are now > 100 years old. The short version is (after the gun has been evaluated by a double gun specialist) pick a 1 oz load at 1200 fps or less and be happy BTW: nice gun that should give you lots of pleasure, but Bro. Rocketman is being generous. The market today for even lightly used vintage "field grade" American and Belgian 12g doubles is very poor, and not likely to improve.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,954 Likes: 12
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,954 Likes: 12 |
BTW: nice gun that should give you lots of pleasure, but Bro. Rocketman is being generous. The market today for even lightly used vintage "field grade" American and Belgian 12g doubles is very poor, and not likely to improve.
Drew, thanks for the feedback. I'll take more data on this type gun at upcoming auctions. I may be getting behind the market trends. DDA
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