doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Off topic. IS a $1000. scope or Binocular worth it

High end binos do have practical benefits, and are a real pleasure to use.

Whether that is "worth it" depends on how important seeing well in tough conditions is to you, and also how much of a financial sacrifice you would need to make to buy them.

I bought a used pair of Swarovski 8.5x40 EL for about half the cost of new. They are truly beautiful to look through, and everyone who uses them comes away impressed. As nice as they are, being a lowly government worker-bee, I wouldn't pay full price for them.

I also have some very high end Austrian scopes. However, I have since migrated to Leupold VX3 glass, which is still high quality but at a substantial savings with no loss of performance for my applications.

Having made astronomy telescope optics from scratch for many years as an amateur hobbyist, quality of workmanship and glass can be difference makers. The best of optical glass necessary for top end refracting scopes can be very expensive, but there is no substitute for larger objective lens assembly aperture and appropriate light cone exit pupil in the eyepiece in capturing light in lowlight conditions. You pays your money and takes your chances.

Thank you to all for your replies.

When I am attempting to get a varmint rifle to shoot a 1/2 inch 100-yard group with a new load and the target center keeps disappearing it gets frustrating. I'm just not sure whether it is old eyes or the scope. I think I'll have to try better scope glass.

Thanks again, to everyone.

I'm picky with optics and wouldn't pay for the expensive ones because I've never felt handicapped with my old B&L 7 X 35s.

High end optics are usually more durable in rugged conditions.

Livorwort, I think you should get to an eye doctor, no matter how crappy the glass is you shouldn't have things disappear. I'm 70 had cataract surgery in both eyes a number of years ago, have floaters I have to wait to get out of the way sometimes. But even with my Leupold VX-1 and 2's 1-4x20mm scopes I can shoot sub-MOA groups to 300 yards(our longest range).

I'm not a big game hunter any longer, I hunt coyotes in up to five states each year, I have a hunting truck set up with a bunk and heat in the back and some times go on month long coyote hunting trips. In most states there is no time restriction on predator hunting. If I can see a coyote with my bare eyes coming in I can kill him with one of my scopes, My coyote rifles wear 1-4x20mm, 1.5-6x40m and one has a 2.5-10x40mm.

I like to build my own rifles and do some wildcatting, so I spend a lot of time at the range, and with my eyes I can no longer shoot open or peep sights so it is scopes on everything.
When I hear people talk about scopes I wonder how I was able to shoot anything in the past. My Metallic Silhouette rifle of the 70's wore a Lyman 10x non-perma center scope and it worked just fine on 500 meter rams, they were clear and crosshairs easily held on the sweet spot to topple one. My still hunting and tracking rifle wore Weaver K-1.5 and V-4.5 never lost a deer because I couldn't see him or put the crosshairs right where they were needed. I did dabble in a little long range deer hunting targeting specific deer that I saw while trapping and a Ruger #1 in 300 Win Mag with the same Lyman 10x worked just fine, heck I could hit a 500 meter ram with it off hand a deer off a rest was a piece of cake.

I personally think that as long as you don't try and stretch your shots beyond where you can hold on fur, which for me is around 300 yards on a coyote even the lowly 1-4x20 scope works just fine, I have them on coyote guns(mostly combo guns) by Leupold, Nikon and Weaver, My favorite coyote/hunting scope is the 1.5-6x40 and have them by Burris, Alpen, Sightron and Bausch&Lomb. To me FOV is way more important than X's.

The only scope to ever fail on me was an old Leupold Vari-X 2 on a lightweight 35 Whelen, the fourth shot made it sound like a maraca.

The biggest mistake I've made over the years is not buying my Swarovski El's sooner.

About ten years ago a buddy & I where hunting elk. We were sitting next to each other glassing the hillside across from us. My friend said there's a nice bull bedded down over there. I looked with my Leopold 10x40 and couldn't spot the bull. My buddy said here use these "Swaro 10 x40EL's" and instantly I could clearly see the bull.

I bought my Swaro's and have never looked back! I'm constantly telling young guy's to put thier money in good glass. When big game hunting you use your bino's 99% of the time and your rifle/scope the other 1%. Your rifle does no good if you can't find the game in the first place.

A good friend of mine drew one of three 2017 desert bighorn sheep tags in New Mexico. He set up his rifles, 25-06 and 300 Winchester Mag) to shoot at the same spot up to 400 yards. He bought a high end range finder and spotting scope and practiced with the rifles and the range finder as well as walking a great deal to get ready for the hunt. On the third day of the hunt they saw sheep on the mountain and drove the jeep as far as possible and then walked to emerge behind where the sheep were last seen. Ben indicated that at first he could not shoot as there were three rams in a row broadside to him and a single shot would kill them all. Of course I discounted his statement figuring that sheep hunters were like fishermen. The rams separated and the one with a full curl was standing broadside to him. Down he went at the first shot. The range finder measured the shot at 25.5 yards. You never can tell. In retrospect Ben indicated he would have done nothing different. Smiles to all.

jborn

I learned a lot when I began shopping for binoculars about 7-8 years ago. I depended upon binoculars a lot because I was doing my deer hunting exclusively with an open sighted flintlock, in all seasons. I loved my little Nikon 7 x 20 compacts, because they were light as a feather. But when I needed them the most... near dawn and dusk, they didn't transmit enough light to make out bucks in the thickets. I had a nice pair of porro prism 7 x 35 Sans & Streiffe model 702's that utilized some superb Japanese glass, but I dropped them out of a tree stand and knocked them out of collimation. My Pentax 7 x 50's are decent, but not great, and way too heavy and bulky for still hunting.

I started out looking at Zeiss, Swarovski, and Leica binoculars that met my criteria. I didn't want over 7x since any hand shake becomes more apparent at higher power. I wanted at least a 5 mm exit pupil since that was the most that 50 year old eyes could utilize anyway, and very important was my self imposed weight limitation of no more than 22 oz., since I tend to do a lot of walking, probably more than I should. In fact, I pushed an 8 point buck to another hunter during a move to another stand on Monday. I soon found that the three ultra premium brands I mentioned were all much heavier in models that met my other criteria.

I continued to do research and comparison shop. I pored over reviews in birding magazines since bird watchers are known for demanding the absolute best in resolution and optics. I actually bought a pair of 8 x 40 Nikons that were highly rated. When I received them, it was a dreary rainy evening. I unpacked them and looked at some distant objects in the waning light. They seemed good until I grabbed those damaged 1960's vintage Sans & Streiffe 7 x 35's. When I torqued the mis-aligned barrels to bring the images back together, I was shocked to find that they were clearer, sharper, and brighter than my brand new Nikons. What really pissed me off was seeing that the Nikons were made in China. I sent the Nikons back and kept shopping. Long story short, I ended up buying a pair of the unfortunately now discontinued Swift Eaglet 825R 7 x 42's. They were, and still are outstanding, with low ED Japanese lenses and prisms. In side by side comparisons to Zeiss and Leica's under the same low light conditions, looking into woods and brush, looking at distant numbers or letters on road signs and mail boxes, looking at roofing slates on a distant barn, they are 98-99% as good for light transmission, clarity, pincushion distortion, edge to edge sharpness, etc., and they cost half as much. But even better to me was that their overall quality came in at 10 - 12 oz. lighter than their much more expensive competition. They weigh 21 oz.

So it boils down to compromise. The absolute very best optics glass in the world unfortunately comes in some heavy packages. That's fine if you sit in a stand all day. I chose to sacrifice perhaps 1% on optical quality in order to not feel like I've carried a brick around my neck all day. There are some real sleepers out there if you shop and compare. That's the hardest part, because it is extremely hard to make a valid comparison unless you can look through several different brands and models under the exact same conditions, at the same time. And looking out the window or door of an optics shop at noon on a clear day won't tell you a damn thing about how they will perform at dusk on an overcast December day in the brush.

If I were young I'd buy the best optics I could find. Yes even if they cost me 1-2000 or more. When you spread the expense over 40-50 years it is not that much a year. At my age I just buy what does the job at hand. Decent, but not too expensive.