doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DIY Gunsmithing @ doublegunshop.com Internal Refitting of a Traditional Gun Case

Now I think is a good time to talk about Baize and what Adhesives to use, for large areas PVA is perfect but it does take time to set though it is far cheaper to use with practically no odour. Next is impact Adhesive this works very well if it is used in its non-impact mode by just applying it with a brush to one part then applying the Baize right away without waiting for the Adhesive to dry first, not so good in poor ventilated areas as my wife will confirm �it makes the whole house smell of the dam stuff.� I will just add here about the low odour versions usually Latex. the few I have tried I have found them to be expensive and not up to the standard of the petroleum based solvent versions and finally Aerosol types not a fan they have a tendency to spray the item yourself the table and the Cat. Finally, Pearl/Animal Adhesive this adhesive I do use on vintage case restoration because it was the Adhesive used right up to the 1950s. It does have a lot going for it too, it can work as an impact Adhesive it grips well does not take long to set can be reversed with hot water or steam and extremely stable with only one drawback it has to be used hot. Finally Baize just a couple of things firstly putting it on is exactly the same principal as wallpapering after a number of gun cases you will be very proficient at hanging wall paper perfectly, oh! did I forget to say the walls of dolls houses. Cut and trim using a sharp knife and scissors it is a true woven material and will stretch more one way than the other so don�t pull it too tight then cut to length because it will end up springing back then being short.
Now why is this case problematical, because I need to save every inch of space from front to back of the case so everything is cut to the bare minimum unlike a single barrel case lay out, that has enough room to fit all the wood dividers then apply the Baize. The barrel compartments past the fore end space towards the muzzle are so narrow that it is imposable to fit the Baize after assembly because you cannot get your fingers in to the barrel compartments to manipulate the Baize to cut or keep the glue brush from spreading its contents on Baize that has already fitted. At the muzzle end of the shorter barrel there is only 1/8� 3mm clearance at the pinch point when the Baize is fitted and the stock and action are lying flat in the case.



Final check of the breach mounting



same for the muzzle blocks. Just to answer a question from a member if you look at both barrel mizzles you will dee the stop block only rises to cover the lower barrel, and in doing so allows finger access to the upper barrel for lifting the barrel out of its compartment. The shorter of the two barrels its block is also designed for finger access, also this block also has to terminate the divider short of the case side. Another part of the block deign even though tapered there is a substantial connection to the case side. I know members are all like me and do not drop gun cases do we? So for the rest who do this configuration will transfer any shock to the case side, if the barrel compartment was to end in mid air and the case dropped the impact would cause the barrel to break out and take a gouge out of the stock.



Final check on the short divider before I fix its end block on and shape its taper. the long divider does not have its block fitted it is fitted to the case.


because of the narrowness of the barrel dividers the bottom Baize is fitted now before any further work. I hope this photograph makes things clear. the clamps are holding the divider and the middle block is in place so I can cut the Baize flush with the wood.




Blocks and divider removed showing the fitted Baize. the other barrel position final fitting before it is fitted, it looks in the photograph that the Baize is fitted to the divider but it isn't it is just folded on so I could take some measurements.

Now there is some light at the end of the tunnel as long as it is not turned off by a large problem. The next photograph is actually showing the amount of clearance between the stock and the shorter barrel divider, this will be further reduced when the Baize is fitted.



This photograph is after I have fitted the short barrel divider to the muzzle mounting block. the longer barrel the block will be mounted to the case first and the divider fitted to it. And so far after shaping everything looks good to go.





The next step is one of the most IMPORTANT steps in the refurbishment of a traditional gun case, if you forget to do it at least an hour of tears and struggle will follow, The reason for doing it will follow but I will make this a "cliff hanger." In the photograph you can see a piece of cardboard kindly supplied by the Kellogg's corporation and it is situated under the dividers and covers the space where the stock and action will be situated, this making a template of the space is necessary and do this for any gun case you work on if you can.







It fitted!



Now it is time to put the Baize on the divider's but only on one side, the side that will be in contact with the barrel the other side the Baize will be fitted later.

The only thing i cant fathom is why you haven't covered the bottom of the case in one piece. I have stripped out many a case and not found a single one that didn't have the bottom covered with one piece? your making a cracking job of it, just wondered what your thoughts are? doing the bottom in one piece certainly saves making the templates up?

Just to remind me I am human and make mistakes this happened, after saying that the Baize on the dividers should be fitted on the divider side next to the barrel, I applied it to the wrong side of the longest barrel divider and this is very noticeable because of the Adhesive and Baize flecks left on the wood after I removed it.
It is now time to fit the barrel blocks permanently to the case I use a gap filling PVA Adhesive just to make sure that that the blocks are well adhered to the case and any gaps between the case and the block are filled with adhesive. I did give this adhesive 12 hours to set because fitting the dividers with so much Baize everywhere I don�t want a problem to arise when fitting them. I fitted the longest divider first with the same gap filling Adhesive though you must first remove the Baize on the barrel side of the divider where it buts up to the blocks so you have a wood to wood joint. Next day I fitted the other divider also making sure that I had the same wood to wood Joins. Just to keep every thing tight as the Adhesive set, I used propping pieces in the same manner as fitting the inner case sides with metal clamps at each end.



One short divider to fit this divides the gun action and stock storage compartment from Accessory storage. It is the smallest divider but it made up its mind to join the enemy making things as difficult as it could, it may be small but it is extremely important that it is rigid and firmly fitted even though each of the end joints are angled. It spans a continuous widening space between the barrel dividers, causing it to move each time it was glued and clamped. To get around this problem I glued a small strip of wood to the case bottom using a couple of drops of super glue to stop it slipping while the Adhesive dried then removed it.



This divider must be a solid fit because it would take the full impact of the action and stock weight if the case where dropped, on many vintage cases this divider was very often pinned at the top using veneer pins. My examples are now rusty because they have sat in a tin for some fifty years with very little use, so I have no intention of purchasing some new bright and shiny replacements. If you decide to pin this divider do not be tempted to use standard panel pins with wood so thin it would be more or less guaranteed to split, if you do use veneer pins you must use a very light pinning hammer because they will bend if you look at them the wrong way.



It is time to explain why it is a necessary to make that template of the gun action and stock compartment in this refit. If you take a look at one of the early photographs there is one with string passing over the guns action giving an aid to measure how much usable height the gun case has. And what I was looking for was could I raise the floor in the action and stock compartment by 3or 4 Milometers without making a noticeable difference to how the gun in the case would look after completion. I Can confidently say that in the number of cases I have repurposed I have only had two that it was not possible to do this.
From the template I will make a false bottom from a suitable piece of material, in this case 3mm MDF, this will enable me to put in the Anchor fitting for an action retaining strap rather than putting it through the case outer leather, though there are other methods though this extra bottom will also support the rather flimsy case bottom too. Using the template, you can mark a line either side of the stock�s wrist giving you the exact position for the action retaining strap anchor. From my template you should be able to get the picture, also I did have to add more card to the template because of some last-minute changes.





A further reason for putting a false bottom in this position is nearly every case I adjusted to take another gun the action retaining strap anchor seemed always in the wrong place, I have marked where the �Pop rivet� was it also was very unsuccessful the strap being so narrow the rivet cut through the strap.
For the action strap anchor I like to use a 5mm Coach Bolt because this size has a lot going for it especially the head size and the short square under the head to stop it turning when epoxied in place. I file the head thickness to milometer so making it easy to recess.











Sandwich of Baize and Leather to determine where to cut the bolt before fitting the new compartment base into the case permanently.
Deamonwolf I hope this will help you to understand now why the case bottom is not one piece of Baize? Also I will have a look at fitting replacement action strap anchors.

I did neglect to say that because the barrel dividers are thinner than normal this made the glue foot print along their length rather small, the addition of the false base gives another glued support for the dividers providing much improved rigidity. I have covered the strap anchor bolt threads with tape to keep the Baize adhesive out of the threads when fitting, also the use of a couple of clothes pegs to keep the Baize out of the way really helps the gun was just to add weight while the new base glue dried.







The Taylors chalk lines on the Baize are to provide the correct cut lines for fitting the Baize for the action and accessories side of the barrel dividers, if anyone was wondering what the tooth brush was for in one of the other photographs they are brilliant for removing Taylors chalk marks from Baize. The other pieces of Baize to be fitted are quite straight forward, one piece on the false base others on the accessory base and the short divider.




Just a quick look at things before moving on to the to the action support blocks, what is very clear in this photograph are the finger lifting access points at the muzzles for removing the barrels from the case. Just a couple of things to fit now, Action retaining strap to make and fit case lid Baize and finally print up a Webley & Scott case Label.

Makes perfect sense thanks for the explanation - I'm currently working on an old case, requiring repairs, reinforcement, refitting and relining for a beautiful Damascus Charles Hellis BLE

The case requires a new end panel as at some point the barrels have burst out the end of their compartment through the perished leather and cardboard.

The Action support blocks were probably the less troublesome things to put together, I prefer to use built up blocks if they are going to be some size as you will see, I have noticed over the years that large blocks that are made from one single piece of wood do have a tendency to twist and can come loose. Also, I changed my mind regarding one of the blocks caused by lack of storage space in the case.


Not sitting very straight.



I will admit to having a pet hate and that is in some cases there is no effort to mount the action and stock level, just letting the action sit on the lower fence and tilt and in doing so eventually cutting the Baize where the gun rests on the case bottom. On a well fitting case the action Bar should sit on a spacing piece, doing this makes the action sit level also putting a slight gap between the lower fence and the case bottom. To keep things overall level and true a spacing piece will also be required fitted under the butt section.









The blocks can now be fitted but remember to remove the Baize so you have a woo to wood glue joints. It will be making the action retaining strap and fitting next, but with a little diversion into what I do if the strap has removed its self from the case or the case was not initially fitted with one.




Snap cap storage taken care of, Anchor stud for fixing action retaining strap very noticeable.

The Action strap not a difficult thing to make well if you work in leather, this is the way it works for me in a word unconventional. After a lot of looking for leather to make straps it always seemed that I would have to buy Meters of the stuff in brown or black, until a chance walk around a Pet store what a revelation. Dog and Cat Collars any length any width any colour, that was quite a number of years ago and I can say I have not bettered that for a one off leather strap with a good quality buckle that is a perfect fit. One word of caution here a good number of the collars have the buckle fitted to the strap with a large rivet, it will be a wise move to remove this and re fit with stitching because in some circumstances this rivet can eat its way into the wrist chequering.





I skive the buckle end of the strap using cause abrasive paper I have tried the knife method and I am not very successful at it, usually cutting straight through the leather on my first attempt so abrasive paper works first time every time for me. This thinning out of the leather on the buckle fold makes the strap a little more flexible making it easier for the strap to buckle up in the confines of the case. Using an impact adhesive, I close the leather around the buckle use a ruler to mark the stitch spacing and drill the holes though you could use a leather awl for the holes.









My straps are only fitted with two holes one for the anchor in the case and the other for the buckle pin, by using a quality leather I have never needed any more holes for the buckle pin because the leather does not stretch.




Because the strap is Anchored to the case with a bolt there is no hiding the fact it requires a nut to seal the whole deal. There is no way to hide that fact my answer is make a flat hand made nut from a piece of Brass the width of the strap and being a clockmaker, I have a lot of off cuts though you can us any metal you have at hand, then cover said nut with Baize so it blends in rather than making it a feature.





Just as an addition to this internal case rebuild, I have had a number of enquiries about fitting and refitting action straps in cases. This is sort of a perennial problem especially in a regularly used gun and case, I have tried a number of ways to repair this is and finally ended up with a method that works for me. There I am sure other methods out there but this method seems to be very reliable and by the way it is constructed replacing a worn or damaged strap is simplicity itself.





This is my universal kit of parts all based around a 5MM Coach bolt and the flat nut previously described the bolt�s head is filed down to approximately 1MM thick the 5mm nut filed to a square matching the bolt leaving a 1MM flange all round plus two pieces of metal approximately 1mm thick with square holes to suit the squares on either the nut or bolt to stop any turning.






Simple method first, on older canvas or leather cases that are let�s say past their best I polish the bolt head, this will now be either painted blued or brass plated. Drill through the case in the appropriate place then fit he bolt measure and cut to length having a square under the head it will not turn when the internal nut is tightened. With the bolt head being flat and thin it is a good external low cost time saving compromise.
Hidden methods 1. As a repair my preferred method is to use one of the plates depending on space. Mark around the plate making sure it is in the correct position for the strap position then cut the case Baize approximately a quarter of an inch larger all around, I prefer to use steam to soften the Adhesive holding the patch of Baize though water can sometimes work. After removing the Baize patch, you can go two ways just remove enough material to allow the bolt head to be below the surface with the plate on top or recess both head and plate. Usually case bottoms are thicker than 2MM and will accommodate bolt head and plate, decide on the bolt length you require then using an Epoxy Adhesive fit bolt and plate into the recess. Remove excess Epoxy level with the surface best dome when just setting, make a hole in the patch to clear the bolt and refit with the appropriate adhesive I prefer PVA because it is easily removed from the patch surface.





2 . Using just a nut and a plate. This I used always on a complete re Baize to a case with no fitted Action strap requirement. You would be surprised how many times after I had done the re Baize work the owner would turn up all apologetic wanting a strap fitted. It is the same method as with the bolt put it in the correct position but make sure that no adhesive can enter the nut, I used cork screwed in. My main reason for using Brass plate for this other than I had a lot was it made it far easier to find the nut under the Baize with a magnet, using a standard nut I found that I would get about two and a half turns fitting the length of threaded rod using thread lock to see it does not undo.

The projects end, it did in places become a little like banging your head on a wall �nice to stop�!! Like all undertakings there are a number of good and bad points about the whole project. Bad points first, the action and stock did not mount in the case horizontal to the case front and back a little painful to my eye, the accessory section is not long enough to store a standard triple wooden cleaning rod set. That being the case I will have to make a set of rods that will fit, so this project has spawned another project thankfully a lot smaller.





The good points, rather than by design the case is very well balanced with regard to carrying, more by good luck than by good judgement. The overall case weight with gun barrels and accessories came to a little over twenty pounds. The Leather did improve in looks better than I expected after dying the scuffs and marks and a good couple of treatments with a coloured Leather conditioner. The case label I made did turn out far better than I could have hoped for. To find a genuine Webley & Scott label the correct era turned out much too difficult, well they where never too common in the 700 shotgun days when they were new.
I have made three lengths of Oak dowel to make the bespoke cleaning rods, though I will now have to look through a lot of storage boxes in my workshop for that special BSB tap for the rod end thread used by Parker hale on their rod accessories. Will make the effort after Christmas to find it.





I hope you did at least find this project interesting enough to encourage you to try your hand at repurposing a gun case.

damascus

Well done! And interesting to boot!