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#558372 - 11/15/19 11:00 AM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
Mills Offline
Sidelock

Registered: 01/10/12
Posts: 276
Loc: GA/SC
Yep. Pre-64 is where I am going

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#558385 - 11/15/19 01:06 PM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
LRF Offline
Sidelock
**

Registered: 05/06/10
Posts: 985
Loc: Minnesota
I claim not to be an expert in anyway however PM me if you wish as I always am open to discuss and if you don't have the Roger Rule book and have a question I would do what I can to assist. Good hunting for a rifle and follows, good hunting once acquired. smile

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#558448 - 11/16/19 10:29 AM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
Jim Kobe Offline
Sidelock

Registered: 05/30/07
Posts: 64
Loc: Minnesota
My bad?
_________________________
Member American Custom Gunmakers Guild

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#558483 - 11/16/19 05:43 PM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
Researcher Offline
Sidelock
***

Registered: 01/01/02
Posts: 5475
Loc: WA/AK
Pre-64 Model 70s have the mystique but they couldn't compete in the market place with the Remington Model 721/722/725 or 700 and the Savage 110. Just like the Model 12 was really dead the day the first Model 870 Wingmaster left Ilion.

Us nostalgia nuts are lucky the Olin brothers kept their hobby in New Haven going as long as they did.

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#558492 - 11/16/19 10:24 PM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
craigd Offline
Sidelock
**

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 6600
I think, it's not quite fair to say that pre 64 Model 70s only attribute is mystique and nostalgia. Surely, it's possible for a rifle to have some attributes without factoring in how it competed in its original market or competes in its current market. While there are facsimilies available, there's a finite pool of originals if it has someone's interest.

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#558508 - 11/17/19 08:30 AM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
rocky mtn bill Offline
Sidelock
**

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 1627
Loc: MT
Another way to state Researcher's point might be to say that Winchester designed a better rifle than they could afford to build. The verdict is rendered by collectors. Who collects Remington 721s or Savage 110s? There is no competition when quality is the criterion. A piece of advice to the new M70 collector: The earlier the rifle, the better. As labor costs rose, quality dropped off. Pre-war and early post-war 70's are nicer than the late ones. Craig is right; it's not just nostalgia. They shoot really well.


Edited by rocky mtn bill (11/17/19 08:46 AM)
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#558533 - 11/17/19 12:28 PM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
rtw Offline
Sidelock

Registered: 12/24/17
Posts: 103
Loc: SE Michigan
I'm a bit confused, which is not an uncommon state for me.

I have owned 2 pre-64 M70's. I am now looking at the new M'70's and am finding very favorable reviews-even compared to the pre-64 versions. The new MOA trigger system is well thought of by most writers-at least among those I have read. Same controlled round feeding. broader selection of calibers, same 3-position safety, etc.

So, why is the pre-64 better? Are there some attributes I don't know about? better rifling? better twist rates? Better steels used? stronger extractors?


Edited by rtw (11/17/19 12:31 PM)

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#558553 - 11/17/19 06:37 PM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
rocky mtn bill Offline
Sidelock
**

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 1627
Loc: MT
The reviewers may lack of knowledge about the earlier rifles. Current models may be fine; they don't interest me. To my knowledge, the M70 triggers were first rate. Whether the new ones are better in some absolute sense is beside the point. The old ones appeal to collectors. The new ones are just hardware.
_________________________
Bill Ferguson

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#558557 - 11/17/19 06:50 PM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: rocky mtn bill]
Run With The Fox Offline
Sidelock
**

Registered: 05/16/08
Posts: 6937
Loc: Michigan
The first series M70's, up until the 1950's when they brought out the FW series- all had lathe cut rifling- and were lead lapped afterwards- took about 11 minutes to machine the rifling-- The FW M70's had the broached rifling, which took less than 1 minute, and those 22" barrels (.308-.243 cal initially)were, along with the aluminum trigger guard and floorplate, the first steps WRA took to reduce mfg. costs on the M70-- Pre-WW2 M70's had better wood grain, checkering, finish than the post WW2 M70's-- one reason- a ton of seasoned walnut went into War production by WRA- 1903's, M-1 Garand and BAR rifles- etc.

I have a 1956 era M70 FW in .308Win--It is a fine weapon, but just doesn't have that "something extra" my oldest M70 (mfg 1939 in 30-06) has- maybe like trying to compare the taste of a fine single malt to that of a blended Scotch-- and taste is, indeed, a subjective quality-- RWTF
_________________________
Now cry Havoc-and let slip the Dogs of War

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#558576 - 11/17/19 09:49 PM Re: Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 vs. Post 64 [Re: Mills]
rtw Offline
Sidelock

Registered: 12/24/17
Posts: 103
Loc: SE Michigan
Found this old post on another forum.

there are many differences in the production of the pre 64's. First was the prewars. These are considered by purists as the finest years. In a nut shell they generally had better wood than later years, had 20 point checkering, a bulbous pistol grip. Then came the transition models from 1946 to 1948, these I personally prefer. Their advantages were, they were drilled and tapped for scope mounts and a safety that would allow usage for scopes. This safety was called a "clamshell safety".These also were still the famous cloverleaf tang and bulbous pistol grip. Next came the 1948 to 1952 models. Their distinction was a change from the cloverleaf tang to the standard tang common to the remainder models including those produced today. Also after 1948 the saftey design is the saftey we still see today and is refered to as the "L" safety. The pistol grip after 1948 went from bulbous to flat for the remainder of production. The other change was the sear hole in the reciever went from a milled square to a faster to produce round hole. After 1952, Winchester was trying to compete with cheaper guns, so they started cutting costs, this is the reason I dont collect any post 1952 models. From 1952 to 1960 the front sight was no longer milled into the barrel but was instead was a soldered ramp plus some minor changes like the bolt knob being drilled. Lastly from 1960 to 1963 the metal buttplate was changed to plastic, the checkering panels were shrunk in size and the bolt shroud was changed from a milled flat surface, and left round to cut costs. Those are the BASICS, there are other smaller changes. I only have one featherweight and while light weight I had changed the aliminum floorplate and triggerguard to a steel model. I found I cant hold steady the featherweight rifle plus I dislike the soldered on front sight. The rear sight "bump" on a standard weight is called a "boss". When you study firearm design you can easily see why the pre-64 Winchester model 70's are justifably called " The Riflemans Rifle". I worked very hard in my carrer and purchased only the best firearms. After considerable study it was an easy decision to collect old Winchesters and Smith & Wesson revolvers.

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