doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Classic & Custom Single Barreled Sporting Rifles @ doublegunshop.com Sedgley 1903 Springfield Engraved 22 Hornet GB

pretty gun but the bolt handle is on the wrong side for me.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/877060678

If I buy it can I send it to eightbore to have the scope mount removed?

Interesting rifle for sure. Probably just me but something looks strange about the engraving. Some is done in full full coverage and other parts in typical pattern patches I will call it. What I mean is the bolt sleeve couldn't be more covered with engraving while the receiver, floor plate, scope mount, etc are nicely done in pattern patches as I will call it. And then the engraving (scrolls for example} are similar in all areas but not the same.

As I said it may be me but I would venture there was more then one engravers and maybe at different times. IMHO

The barrel at least has seen some buffer time. Maybe, that rifle was found in rough shape, and some of the 'engraving' is covering pitting? The stock doesn't look right either, proceed with caution?

I agree with the buffing as you can see the dished out screw holes in the barrel.
Would be interesting to know if all the remain serial numbers match on the receiver, bolt, etc

At least a couple different engravers,,I think more.
Probably started as some nice engraved parts and was built into a great looking rifle with the addition of some lucky finds and some labor.

I think any orig Springfield ser# is long gone from the recv'r with that Moose portrait.
That makes matching ser's up kinda hard to do. They're likely missing from any other part (bolt?) that should have had one.
But the excuse if it is one is that it's a custom build and it doesn't matter,,it's not a factory rifle anyway.
A Sedgley ser# would be nice.
IIRC they very often marked their ser# in the sear channel at the rear of the action. Not always,,but frequently.
Nothing as far as factory records to refer to that I know of and a pretty easy thing to fake,,so don't place too much faith if seeing a number stamped down in there.

It's a 'Sedgley' because it says so on the bbl.,,That's not saying much when you think about it and take a long look.

The bolt shroud, cut-off and bolt handle are one very talented engravers work. I'd add the scope base too.
The engraving on the action itself around the back where those parts are mounted is nowhere near the same.
Neither is the little touch added to the side of the Lyman rear sight. Doesn't match at all.

But then the moose on the front ring is much better quality than the engraving on the back portion of the action,,but,,the scroll doesn't match in size or pattern to that on the shroud, bolt handle or cut-off.
Some what,,close,,but not the same. Something a talented and experienced engraver wouldn't do.
Using different styles on the same gun is often done,,but it doesn't fit here.

The back end of the bbl looks alot like it may have been done by the Moose engraver. Really hard to make a call as the pic is so fuzzy.
The portion of the bbl engraving further out by the bbl address looks like a 5 yr old did it. As does the simple border work around the front sight.
Just because it's simple and small in area does mean the engraver flips it off and does a crap job of it.

Not someone that has the skill and patience to cut what you see on that bolt handle and shroud & cut-off. Very difficult parts to cut with their varying contours and sharp radius's.

The Trigger Guard and Floor Plate look like someone else again! Different scroll pattern and layout.
Maybe these pieces found as an engraved set and simply installed. The use of a liner tool used somewhat, something I don't see in the rest of the engraving. Maybe it's hidden in the fuzzy photo's.
The bluing on the TG and Floor Plate looks different that the other blued parts on the gun,,more old school Europe for lack of a better wording . Might just be the pics though.

The Butt plate and grip cal look like standard German imports of the pre and post WW1 period that came already engraved if you wanted them that way.

The caliber marking is .22 WCF / Hornet
22WCF is a .228 bullet dia cartridge designed for BP
.22 Hornet at the time was a .223d bullet
Slightly different case dimensions as well.

Which is it and whose bbl is it.
Sedgleys bbl of the proper bore dia and for which of the two cartridges.
Or the orig Springfield .22rf bbl rechambered and to what.
Sedgley proofed their bbls and stamped them with an S in a circle

Those Sedgley marking look goofy too when you enlarge them by clicking on the pic (#24) especially the Phila, PA, USA.
and check out the scroll work right behind it.

Just some things I see,,some may just being pics playing trixs.
But I think the rifle is parts made up into a rifle. Some nice parts and some that don't fit in so nicely.
It all depends on what it looks like when examined 'in hand' and what the real world price is (how bad you want it!)

I believe the Sedgley barrel marking is OK, many of them have some letters not fully stamped but this Hornet does not have the Sedgley Hornet magazine box and follower. It does have the Sedgley hole in the floorplate for their magazine box. None of the engraving is in the Sedgley Deluxe pattern which had some simple engraving on the tang while this one has none. I also don't think the stock is Sedgley as the cheekpiece and checkering patterns are not typical Sedgley.

What I've seen on engraved guns, and was reinforced while speaking to a member of the Engraver's Guild, was that often engraving shops had their master engravers do the large patterns, and apprentices or lower level engravers do borders, and other repetitive work.
That might not apply to this gun, but just mentioning it. I've got some engraved 1800's single shot rifles, and on them I can easily see the repetitive work around borders, and the difference in the scrolls, leafs, or animals cut in the main pattern. The depth of the two areas, and style show significant differences in the two worker's hands.

I see it ended at $3725.00. I think that's a very favorable price given all that was suspect about it.

Yes I agree and I hope the buyer knew someting more about the rifle then we did.