doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com remington 1894 chambers

1894s I'm eyeballing on websites are variously described as having 2 1/2" or 2 3/4" chambers, while I have read that the common chamber length for this model was 2 5/8". What's the real story here? Is chamber length stamped on the barrel flats?

Another curious thing is that a number of the 2 3/4" guns are damascus. It seems to me that the fluid steel barrels would be more likely to have been bored with longer chambers.

It is very likely that the real story is "inexpert" chamber length measuring.

Yes, the Remington Hammerless Model of 1894 had 2 5/8" chambers, as did the Model 1889 hammergun and AFAIK Hammerless Model of 1900

1901 Model 1889 hammergun hang tag specified 3 Drams DuPont Smokeless Powder and 1 1/4 oz. No. 8 shot (511 pellets) in 2 5/8” U.M.C. “Smokeless” shells

A 1907 DEO Trap 12g Remington Hammerless hang tag specifies 3 Drams (22 gr.) “Infallible” with 1 1/4 oz. No. 8 “Standard Chilled Shot” in a 2 5/8” UMC Nitro Club shell

A 1908 hang tag for a 12g Remington 1900 KE Hammerless states that the gun was targeted with 24 grains (3 1/4 Dr. Eq.) of “Infallible” in a 2 5/8 inch U.M.C. “Nitro Club” shell with 1 1/4 ounce of #8 chilled shot.

Chamber length was not marked unless non-standard

An 1894 C grade with Etoile damascus



An 1894 DEO



And Remington made no distinction between Remington Steel, Ordnance Steel, or Damascus regarding the recommended loads; all "Guaranteed For Nitro Powder"

By and large the Remington Hammerless Doubles were chambered for 2 7/8-inch shells in 10-gauge, 2 5/8-inch shells in 12-gauge and 2 9/16-inch shells in 16-gauge. If a gun was ordered for longer shells the length was stamped on the bottom of the tube just forward of the barrel flat. I've never seen a 10- or 16-gauge so stamped. These are both 12-gauges.





Except for the very earliest guns, the surviving 12-gauge hang tags show the guns targeted with Union Metallic Cartridge Co. Load No. 8 (SMOKELESS, TRAP or ARROW shells) or X8 (NITRO CLUB shells), 3 drams of bulk smokeless powder or 24-grains of dense smokeless powder such as Infallible or Ballistite pushing 1 1/4 ounce of #8C from a 2 5/8-inch shell.



Now the fly in the ointment. These hang tags for late guns still show 2 5/8-inch shells.





But circa 1907 all of our North American ammunition companies, including Union Metallic Cartridge Co., quit putting 1 1/4-ounce 12-gauge loads in 2 5/8-inch shells. From then on one had to go to a 2 3/4-inch or longer shell for the 1 1/4-ounce loads.

Also, it is hard to say what may have been done to a chamber in the 112 or more years since these guns were made, and I wouldn't put too much faith in what many gun dealers state in their descriptions.

Thanks as usual all the information when could hope for on this forum.
So, examination of the barrel flats will provide evidence of factory 2 3/4" chambers. Does anyone have issue with shooting loads under 9000 LUP (PSI) in a damascus 1894 declared sound?

Dave: it the 2 3/4 marked gun a D grade? The pattern looks like "Legia P."

re: "declared sound" means the bore examined with a bore scope and with careful measurements of the wall thickness at the end of chamber, 3", 6", 9", 12" from the breech, 9" from the muzzle, the MWT measurement and location thereof, and those measurements documented in a written report; by someone with the interest, expertise and equipment to properly evaluate the barrels.
MWT alone is NOT an adequate evaluation.

It is 123247 a DE-Grade, 30-inch sold at the October 2017 Julia's Auction -- https://www.morphyauctions.com/jamesdjulia/item/52027-1-397/

Lock up appears to be a single bite and the rib extension, is that correct?

I shoot a circa 1907 1894 BE with Damascus with some regularity. I shoot 2 1/2” mostly with pressures under 8500 psi. Sometimes I’ll run a box of 2 3/4” shells through it with pressure down in the low 6000s so whatever pressure spike may occur, it’s still well under 8000 psi. Likely still under 7000 psi. Given the thickness of the barrels (don’t have the measurements handy but they are thick) I’m pretty comfortable. I suspect they would handle modern pressure just fine.

No one can tell you over the internet what ammunition may or may not be safe in a given gun.

My Father bought a high condition 1896 vintage AE-Grade 12-gauge, 30-inch, from Osborne & Uland in Seattle during WW-II. From then until he quit hunting after the 1988 season it was his favorite upland shotgun. It digested a lot of 2 3/4-inch Remington Express, Western Super-X, etc. as well as a lot of trap/dove loads. It shows the wear, but still looks fine in my gun safe.

FWIW -- The heaviest 12-gauge loads our North American ammunition companies offered during the time these guns were being made carried 3 1/2 drams of bulk smokeless powder or 28-grains of dense smokeless powder, such as Infallible or Ballistite, pushing 1 1/4 ounce of shot. According to some DuPont powder booklets from the 1920s and 30s the pressure of these loads exceeded SAAMI specs which came in during the mid-1920s.