doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Manufrance Simplex

I just bought a Manufrance Simplex on GB (only bidder). The details were a little sketchy but I took a chance for the price. I like British/European singles in the better grades.

I was wondering if anyone has a source for Manufrance catalogs. I found a few for sale on the net, eBay etc, but they are all French and for sale there. It doesn't appear that these have been reproduced like other catalogs, and the available ones are scarce and really pricey.
I found a copy of a 1919 catalog on eBay France that pictures what looks to be exactly the gun I bought, but the photo of the catalog page is not very sharp. Any one who knows of a source for a prewar catalog at a reasonable price, I would appreciate the info.

The gun I bought is in decent condition, with pretty extensive engraving, really good quality wood, and in 16 gauge. It has no safety, which I believe means 130 or earlier construction.Some of the other catalogs I saw for sale showed these guns available as single shot rifles, some in some really healthy calibers. That would explain the robustness of the action and the heavy monobloc construction. I did notice in the 1919 catalog that some guns were made with exposed hammers, and the action design had a removeable top plate that allowed a hammer spur to protrude. The later guns (50's and later) in the pictures I have found appear to have a sort of plate extractor at the breech which extends past the action side for manual extraction. Kind of ungainly looking and not of the same quality finish as the old guns.

When I get it, I will post some pitures for comments.

A few quick comments. More details will have to await pictures; FAB500 will likely comment too.

Manufrance early records were lost in a flood in the 1930's? However, there has been a lot of research on early models:

Jean-Claude Mournetas wrote very well known books on Manufrance including the "Ideal" and the "Robust." These volumes included charts to date the guns by model number:
https://www.leslibraires.fr/livre/1...l-de-la--jean-claude-mournetas-pecari-ed
https://www.amazon.fr/Fusil-Robust-J-C-Mournetas/dp/291284861X

The charts are posted on this line p.10 & p.11:
https://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=488406

He also wrote on "The Simplex" here which I'll try to take a look at: (Canvasback on this site might have the book; he had both the Ideal and Robust books; Gil - GLS - certainly had both) - Note "roi des fusils à un coup" - King of the single shot:
https://www.eyrolles.com/Accueil/Livre/le-fusil-simplex-9782912848048/

This advice from another site: "If you remove the butt stock recoil pad or plate the date of manufacture will be stamped on the end of the wood stock..."

I would be willing to translate selected articles from the catalogs if you can identify them. On the other hand once photos are posted, FAB500 might point us more to the correct year.

Incidentally, this also from another site - cannot vouch for it but it sounds right:

"Simplex shotguns are made by MANUFRANCE since 1908. They are still made. These guns were widely used when using conditions were bad or very bad:sea side,equatorial Africa,south america(Guyana...) because they were sturdy and inexpensive.

Let me tell you one use :the gun was loaded with a cartridge cut just over the wad ,then a wood arrow of the bore diameter with iron point was introduced by the barrel muzzle and the gun was fired in order to kill ....elephants!! Of course the shooter had to fire point-blank and run or climb a tree very quickly!! Just to say the guns were sturdy ones. Another type of users were people without a lot of money and youngs.

First this shotgun was only produced in 12 and 16 gauges but a few years later in 20 and 24 gauges for youngs. In the other side,10 gauge (for waterfowl),and rifled barrels in 375HH ,305 WCF...,the action was strong enough to accept these cartridges. After 1920,the barrel had a tight full choke,before the barrel was less choked. In 12 and 16 gauges the chamber length was 65mm during the 50 first years of production,then it was 70 or 76mm.
The early models had either an outside hammer or were hammerless.The first type was stopped in 1930.The safety appeared only during this year.

The butt pad was iron made during the first years,then horn . Bakelite appeared around 1950. The gun is still made:
12 gauge, 3" chamber, 80cm barrel length
20 gauge, 3" chamber, 76 cm barrels. Both have a beech stock and forearm."

French gun term added to the French-English dictionary:
Monocoup - single shot

 

Thanks for the info. I will check it to see what is there. I had found a copy of the Ideal book available on eBay and it is in the mail.
I should have the gun in a week or so and will post some pictures. As I said, the extensive nice quality engraving and the high quality of the wood suggested that this was a relatively high grade gun. Also interesting was the fact that of the pictures of catalog pages I could find seemed to be geared toward showing the rifle version instead of the shotgun. The one I did find that had some information on the model was 1919 and showed that they used the same frame for both hammer and hammerless, but a blanking filler was installed on the hammerless model. The internals drawing looked like the same hammer was used for both except that the spur was not on the hammerless model.

This was added in edit. Just wanted to make sure you saw it:

This advice from another site: "If you remove the butt stock recoil pad or plate the date of manufacture will be stamped on the end of the wood stock..."

I usually strip and do a clean/lube/inspection on guns I acquire. I will pull the buttplate and check. I did find a post somewhere which stated that the grade is stamped under the forend. No idea if that is correct, but I will check that too.

The Simplex single should be here tomorrow. I am going to post some of the sales photos now. I will examine the gun and report any details I can find either tomorrow or Friday.

Nice looking wood. Gil

Yeah, that's one reason I bought it (sucker that I am for Walnut). The wood and the pretty nice engraving are what makes me believe this is a relatively high grade. I have never seen one in person, but I have seen a dozen or so in pictures. I have only seen 1 that I thought was a higher grade, with somewhat more engraving. It was, I believe, reported to be marked as a Model 86, but that may not be correct. I will hopefully look for a model number tomorrow.

Nice looking gun, sleek...as a single barrel should be. Interesting that it has a straight "English" stock; the French preference was for a half-pistol grip stock. I started out shooting a single barrel US made 12 gauge when I was 14...still have it...it cost $5 at the time and am wondering now how many times I've actually fired two barrels at one bird or clay.

I have little info on the Simplex because we just haven't run across them. There is that Mournetas book but I can't buy it - don't have room anymore. If there is an article or chapter though that you come up with, photograph it and I'll help translate it. Look forward to more. I expect once you get good photos of the rest of the numbers and proof marks FAB500 can help.

There are two books regarding MF shotguns exclusively--The Robust and The Ideal and neither discuss the Simplex .The reason you were the only bidder on the gun was because I wasn't aware of the listing. Superficially it appears to have the same "break action" of the Ideal, but in reality it is different. To open the Simplex, the "stub' on what at appears to be on the trigger guard is pulled away from the action to open the action whereas on the Ideal, there is a trigger guard apart from the stub activated barrel release which must be squeezed towards the grip to open the action with its rising bite. While I've never seen one in hand, the single shot most likely doesn't have a rising bite and is far simpler, hence the name. While the photos show wear, I doubt if the wear was the result of much handling in the field as there wouldn't be the same amount of case coloring left on the action as appears in the photo. As has been noted by others with more knowledge than I have, MF could care less about marketing its guns outside of France and its territorial possessions and somehow that gun made it over here--possibly in a GI's duffle bag after WWII. Gil
PS: I missed Gene's description of the third MF book by Mournetas on the Simplex. Duly noted.