doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Question for driven bird shooters

I know when walking up birds a light gun is ok even if the shells have a bit more recoil because you are only shooting a few times. If you are shooting driven pheasant and using a light 20 ga gun what load would you want to use? The 20 ga SxS I planned to use broke saturday and hopefully will be fixed, but if not I am going from a 7 lb 20 ga Sxs to a 6 lb 3 oz SxS

Remember the old rule, six pounds of gun for every ounce of shot.

3/4 oz. of shot, applied without a flinch, is likely to be more lethal than an ounce which kicks you.

I stay below 1oz for 20 ga driven birds.
For tall birds, I up the shot size, increase the speed, and go up to 1oz.

Some like the 3/4oz Hull “Grouse” cartridge at 1450fps
I’ve been using Eley Zenith for a few years.

Both are quite snappy.

I have run thousands of rounds of 20 ga. through a 6 lb. 5 oz. double gun on doves in Argentina. The doves there are certainly not driven but are traveling in a straight line, which usually is towards you, so the result is the same as driven birds, whether pheasants or doves. The point of the question here is not about the quarry, but the load and the gun.


So, here's the facts. I ran an average of 1300 rounds per day (6 hours of shooting) through my Beretta 687 SP II Sporting, which weighs exactly 6 lbs. 5 oz. with extended choke tubes in place. It weighs exactly 6 lbs. 3.7 oz. with the Beretta flush tubes in place. I shot 7/8 oz. loads 90% of the time, with the other 10% being with 1 oz. loads. One morning I drew a stand that presented very high incoming doves and the bird boy had provided 1 oz. loads in anticipation of this. I shot them for a while, missing the high doves badly. I finally figured out that I was leading them too much. When I cut my lead back they started falling like on the other days. I told the bird boy to go get me some 7/8 oz. loads and lose the 1 oz. ones. With M and an IM chokes I went back to a high average with the 7/8 oz. loads.

The only ill effects I experienced from this high volume was a very slight tenderness in my shoulder pocket which was totally gone the next morning. Four days shooting in a row. I experienced no recoil related issues with the 1 oz. loads that morning. I just had to figure out the lead. Extra payload won't make up for poor shooting.

Take home . . . . . I see no reason why a well fitting 6 lb.+ gun can't be used with 7/8 oz. - 1 oz. loads in a large amount. That said, we don't all have the same tolerance for recoil. So, adjustments must be made to accommodate for that.

Pheasants are a bit more tenacious than doves, or, grouse, or woodcock, or quail.

I remember recoil at the patterning board. I don’t when shooting in cold blood at birds.

I have had 20 gauge guns (more than one, actually) that threw lousy patterns with 7/8ths ounce loads. To a one, they straightened right up with 1 ounce loads. I own a Richland double that weighs more than a few 12s ‘aboot the place, that throws superb patterns with 7/8th ounce loads. Heavy little pig, too, over 6 1/2lbs. But, it has 3” chambers. To be expected, I guess.

I don’t know that I have ever loaded a cartridge that was going 1450fps. That sounds harsh.

Best,
Ted

Agreed, based on my shoots of pen-raised pheasants, never hunted wild ones, which I would assume are only tougher to down. However, the driven pheasants in the UK are also pen-raised and released, and supposedly provide great sport.

Sir Joseph Nickerson, who wrote the excellent book A Shooting Man's Creed, and killed more feathered game in his life than Lord Ripon, used 20s and 28s for many, many years. He stated in the book that 13/16 oz. shot is a gracious plenty. I will defer to his experience. Any man who surpassed Ripon's tally in their lifetimes has my attention when he speaks of guns and loads.

Driven pheasant are actually easier to kill, as you are shooting (hopefully) in the face vs up the back there are protected by more feathers and bone. On wild phez I usually use 1 oz of 5's but in the course of a day may only shoot 10 times.
I appreciate the feedback. I normally shoot 3/4 oz reloads through my 20's but tried some factory 7/8 oz loads yesterday and the good news I shoot the light 20 bore very well. Recoil is more noticeable but I think in the heat of a drive will be less so.