doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com W. Palmer Jones - Thoughts

Hi all, in my quest for an engish gun, I've run across quite a few makers not as well known as others. One of these is W. Palmer Jones. What can any of you tell me about the quality of this gun to say other better known makers, like W. Richards, etc.

I know judge the gun not the maker, just wanted to get a general opinion on overall quality.

Thanks so very much!!

Greg

Is the Jones a Birmingham boxlock? Also, don't assume that a W. Richards is a Westley Richards because Westley shouldn't be an initial only in the name.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Greg - you are still trying to take too much information from the maker's name. Guns were made to price points, which set the original quality grade. Learn to evaluate original quality grade and current condition.

W(illiam) Richards of Preston and Liverpool supplied most quality grades of guns. Beware of JABC's with W. Richards on them. Westley Richards always used "Westley" and never just W.

Hey Rocketman, you are right about the makers and gun. I can't agree with you more, I guess what I'm trying to get at is like comparing a Purdey with a Stoeger Uplander, just trying to get a general feel for a maker. Their reputation in the gunmaking world overall. One can go from there with an individual gun as you say.

I was just putting a W. down to shorten it up, I mean Westley Richards - not the cheap knockoffs from the early 1900's.

Hope this clears things up some. Hey, thanks again for all the great posts - you folks are great!

All the best!!

Greg

gjw:

In theory, you could purchase 1/2 dozen Birmingham boxlocks of similar quality from 1/2 dozen makers from the Golden Era of doublegun crafting and they might be finished somewhat different. But most of the primary parts could have been made by the same firm or by the same craftsman who was drawn away from one maker to another by an increase in wages. Rocketman's point of price targets in the different models or grades is where the greatest differential in quality will be and typically not between makers.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

There is a article on W Palmer Jones in the Shooting Sportsman(June July1989)by Ron Forsyth an australian.He notes the excellant quality of Jone's guns& his 1904 sidelock in particular.Despite this quality Forsyth says he'd seen few examples of this maker's guns in the used market. Heritage guns ( a english gun dealer has a write up on a W.P. Jones in their "sold" section.
I have a W.P. Jones 12 ga magnum from the 1930's # 20xxx)which I'm told is a very well made gun by a local english trained gunsmith
Good luck in your search

NCR

Greg - I understand what you are asking. Logical as it seems, that information is just not in the maker's name. For example, that Purdey you refered to as a benchmark - would that be a Beasley patent sidelock or the "E" grade boxlock? Mighty big difference. By name, both are a Purdey. Any Brit master could get out a best quality gun - if only a commission came in to do so. Purdey's got a lot of commissions and W. P. Jones got few. A Jones best is as good as a Purdey's best, but then so would be equal grades of boxlocks. A typical Jones boxlock is not, however, going to be the equal of a Purdey's best SLE (there were also graded SLE's) or vise versa. It is well worthwhile to know the history of the makers of your guns. But, it is financial folly to try to associate original quality grades of individual guns with makers' names.

Rocketman, point well taken! Perhaps I should restate my question.

What can anyone tell me about this maker?

Thanks so much!!

Greg

The Jones family of Birmingham gunmakers was established in 1817. William Palmer Jones,is recorded as the principal of the company, 1881-1900,located at, 75,Bath Street,Birmingham. The business moved to 25,Whitall Street,circa 1900 and remained at this location until 1940. In 1940 the name was changed to; W.Palmer Jones[Guns]Ltd;The business remained active at various Birmingham locations until approx; 1965.
William Palmer Jones was one of Birminghams most prolific inventors. His most note worthy invention being the "Try Gun"., patented in 1889. A detailed reviews of William Palmer Jones, acomplishments is to be found in the,"Birmingham Gunmakers", by Douglas Tate and in "Experts on Guns and Shooting", by G.T. Teasdale-Buckell.
The W. P. Jones guns that I have seen have been of the highest quality and in particular his sidelock ejectors.

The flipside would be, there are Wm. Richard guns that are on par with or better Westley's.
The trick is; I've had a Jos. Lang Westley Richards made blne that beat most of the Westley Richards' marked guns in everyway of fit 'n finish.