Thinking along the same lines Geno. I was wondering about the Walking Stick Gun cartridge. They were usually found in 7mm., 9mm. and 12mm. The 12mm. W.S round eventually became the more familiar .410 shotgun round and in fact some of the older ones in my collection are marked 12mm/.410. French rounds are usually marked 12mm Canne. They are real collector's items now. Lagopus.....