doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com E.M. Reilly; History; Chronology; Serial Numbers

=============== 502 (16) New Oxford Street – A response ================

Thank you for your observation Bill...though it as usual took the form of a polemical rant rather than an academic query. This topic was addressed in detail on the Reilly line. The following is for those who have not, cannot, or have refused to read it:

1. Historical footprint: Buildings change, facades are redone, buildings are torn down and rebuilt. Clearly the modern building at 16 New Oxford Street is a story taller than the one pictured in 1885. What does not change however is the footprint. The Reilly building in whatever form it was, which was held as a freehold, was huge for London and it likely existed in the re-facaded 1885 photo form until it was sold ih 1897. It's interesting however, that the fundamental layout remains to this day which makes one wonder whether the original building is still there.

2. London “factories” and “workshops”: London was a city of small shops. Here is a description of capitalism in London based on the 1851 census (which was going to be address in chapter 16):

*16e - Number of employees: London: A Social History:


As an example Purdey operated out of two buildings at 314 and 315 Oxford Street from 1820’s to 1881. It was called “314 ½” as a compromise. There is not one existing photo of that building according to the Purdey historian. (This would mean it didn't exist according to some knowledgeable posters). However Here is a picture I extracted and sent to them:

Reilly’s 315 Oxford Street (post 1858) and Purdey’s 314 ½ Oxford Street from an 1883 photo:


Here is the modern building for Reilly 315 Oxford Street and Purdey at 314 ½ Oxford Street:



The buildings are not the same – they are less tall for sure. (Reily's son fell from the top floor of 277 and died in 1895). But take a look at the footprint for Purdey. That building for 50 years was where Purdey built his guns, sold and fitted his guns, and was the administration headquarters.
That SIR is a London FACTORY!

3. Number of Reilly workers in 1851. We have no idea how many workers Reilly employeed in 1851. The gun business was highly cyclical – when a big order came in, workers were added. On the Process of Small Arms Manufacturer, 1870

. . .-- In 1881 Reilly told the census taker he employeed 300 men (Greener 140). But Reilly at that time had two large workshops (he had only one building in 1851), a store in Paris and may have had concerns or a partnership of sorts in Birmingham. And he had just expanded his business dramatically from making 650 numbered guns in the 1870’s to over 1,000.
But sir, 1851 is NOT 1881...GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!

4. "Keith" and his credibility: A word about “Keith" (Bill from Pennsylvania). He may know something about American guns but that’s difficult to know because he spends so much time spewing hate and honing his “enemies list.” What is clear from several posts on this line is that he knows nothing about English guns or the London gun trade and he has no interest in reading what has been written, learning, or asking coherent questions.

He has disrupted dozens of lines and is simply not credible as an observer or a scholar. I won’t bother to respond to him again.

Gene Williams

However, I have sent him my telephone number. He can call to discuss the above...or I would gladly welcome him in McLean or I could drive up to Pennsylvania for a face to face to clear the air. One somehow doubts he will.

Edit: I have added pictures of Purdey factory at 314 1/2 Oxford Street and Lang at 22 Cockspur Street to the above post on Reilly's new 502 New Oxford Street, so that people not familiar with the London gun scene can understand. Thanks Bill for providing the example.